Comments on: China to invade Vietnam? http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/ Speak Victorian, Think Pagan Sat, 20 Mar 2010 04:47:48 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: GambleLover http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-386391 GambleLover Fri, 14 Nov 2008 09:07:10 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-386391 Hello everyone, I do not think China has any plan to do this. It is apparently someone's evil trick again to increase the tension between the two countries and take advantages from this at the end. USA? Japan? Vietnam? or what? I am wondering if Vietnam is so naive to believe this? Vietnam made a voice for some reasons other than the mentioned non-existing plan. What reasons? You guys think about it. Hello everyone,

I do not think China has any plan to do this. It is apparently someone’s evil trick again to increase the tension between the two countries and take advantages from this at the end. USA? Japan? Vietnam? or what? I am wondering if Vietnam is so naive to believe this? Vietnam made a voice for some reasons other than the mentioned non-existing plan. What reasons? You guys think about it.

]]> By: Jennifer http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385645 Jennifer Thu, 25 Sep 2008 10:50:50 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385645 Yours Truly: Don't worry, I was just making a point to Euv. Personally I don't think the Chinese are going to do it as those who wrote the so-called 'conspiracy theory' are probably people who haven't been through proper military training. If this theory was actually real, the news should be spread all over the world by now (which it didn't, only a small part of the news leaked through). What I really wanted to know is that why are they posting this on the internet? If this article wasn't true, the Chinese government will probably track down whoever wrote this. So what kind of benefit are they getting from posting up a piece of false information? Yours Truly: Don’t worry, I was just making a point to Euv. Personally I don’t think the Chinese are going to do it as those who wrote the so-called ‘conspiracy theory’ are probably people who haven’t been through proper military training. If this theory was actually real, the news should be spread all over the world by now (which it didn’t, only a small part of the news leaked through).
What I really wanted to know is that why are they posting this on the internet? If this article wasn’t true, the Chinese government will probably track down whoever wrote this. So what kind of benefit are they getting from posting up a piece of false information?

]]> By: Yours Truly http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385638 Yours Truly Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:55:27 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385638 Quite DISSED with all 'em nationalists & "patriots" of all stripes. S!@#$%^&*()_s can go f!@#$%' FIGHT for their countries, instead of 'em REAL PATRIOTS in their countries (re : armed forces personnel). People who have never even damn used weapons or involved 'emselves in war before should just shut the hell up. MHO. Quite DISSED with all ‘em nationalists & “patriots” of all stripes. S!@#$%^&*()_s can go f!@#$%’ FIGHT for their countries, instead of ‘em REAL PATRIOTS in their countries (re : armed forces personnel). People who have never even damn used weapons or involved ‘emselves in war before should just shut the hell up. MHO.

]]> By: Yours Truly http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385637 Yours Truly Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:49:13 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385637 Jennifer : I really doubt that the chinese are in any position to start invadin' her neighbors...fact being they've got enough INTERNAL TROUBLES of their own. & it would be TRAGIC for 'em to start attackin' countries where there are very substantial populations of ethnic chinese o'er in those places. Anyways, it would be foolhardy to assume that wagin' war with the Vietnamese is gonna be a cakewalk. Not so much 'bout the material wealth of the populace in a country (in fact material obsession kills a peoples' esprit de corps), but the Vietnamese have always been tough fellas. Jennifer : I really doubt that the chinese are in any position to start invadin’ her neighbors…fact being they’ve got enough INTERNAL TROUBLES of their own.

& it would be TRAGIC for ‘em to start attackin’ countries where there are very substantial populations of ethnic chinese o’er in those places. Anyways, it would be foolhardy to assume that wagin’ war with the Vietnamese is gonna be a cakewalk.

Not so much ’bout the material wealth of the populace in a country (in fact material obsession kills a peoples’ esprit de corps), but the Vietnamese have always been tough fellas.

]]> By: Jennifer http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385630 Jennifer Wed, 24 Sep 2008 14:05:44 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385630 Euv, even though People's Republic of China claimed Taiwan but they do not have the entire control over Taiwan. Today, the things that are made from Taiwan are still marked 'Made from Taiwan' so that means that PRC does not have the control over the economy. The main reason PRC is trying to attack Vietnam is to get the oil from the South China's Sea and oil = economy. Therefore, what I am trying to say is that PRC will have to take control over Taiwan to completely claim Taiwan as its own. So Elambend was right, PRC still needs to attack Taiwan (but they should not, Taiwan is a great place, nobody wants war there). Anyway, Vietnam isn't easy to dominate over. If it is, Vietnam would not be Vietnam, it'd probably be a part of France or USA by now. Usually people would think that Vietnam is a poor country and is very easy to control over...etc. They are indeed wrong. Vietnam's economy is growing rapidly as the quality of a Vietnamese's life is getting better and better everyday. Nowadays, you can see expensive cars all around Hanoi or Ho Chi Minh City or other growing cities. Vietnam is developing well, why should we start another war so we can start the whole thing all over again? There are people out there who went to Vietnam once and wanted to go again. If the war starts, nobody will get to go to Vietnam anymore. Noodle soup won't be available anymore as many other great food will not be there as well. (If you're thinking that you'll get noodle soup in other countries, you are wrong. Sure they have them, but the ones in Vietnam are always the best). Euv, even though People’s Republic of China claimed Taiwan but they do not have the entire control over Taiwan. Today, the things that are made from Taiwan are still marked ‘Made from Taiwan’ so that means that PRC does not have the control over the economy. The main reason PRC is trying to attack Vietnam is to get the oil from the South China’s Sea and oil = economy. Therefore, what I am trying to say is that PRC will have to take control over Taiwan to completely claim Taiwan as its own. So Elambend was right, PRC still needs to attack Taiwan (but they should not, Taiwan is a great place, nobody wants war there).
Anyway, Vietnam isn’t easy to dominate over. If it is, Vietnam would not be Vietnam, it’d probably be a part of France or USA by now.
Usually people would think that Vietnam is a poor country and is very easy to control over…etc. They are indeed wrong. Vietnam’s economy is growing rapidly as the quality of a Vietnamese’s life is getting better and better everyday. Nowadays, you can see expensive cars all around Hanoi or Ho Chi Minh City or other growing cities. Vietnam is developing well, why should we start another war so we can start the whole thing all over again? There are people out there who went to Vietnam once and wanted to go again. If the war starts, nobody will get to go to Vietnam anymore. Noodle soup won’t be available anymore as many other great food will not be there as well. (If you’re thinking that you’ll get noodle soup in other countries, you are wrong. Sure they have them, but the ones in Vietnam are always the best).

]]> By: Chinese Bloggers « 1000 Questions http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385537 Chinese Bloggers « 1000 Questions Fri, 12 Sep 2008 04:31:49 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385537 [...] in Uncategorized Apparently Chinese Bloggers want to invade Vietnam now.  Now I’m not saying Chinese bloggers have a strong grip on reality at the best of times - [...] [...] in Uncategorized Apparently Chinese Bloggers want to invade Vietnam now.  Now I’m not saying Chinese bloggers have a strong grip on reality at the best of times – [...]

]]> By: Curzon http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385533 Curzon Thu, 11 Sep 2008 16:19:18 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385533 Spoken like an area studies expert, Lirelou. Thanks for that. Spoken like an area studies expert, Lirelou. Thanks for that.

]]> By: lirelou http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385532 lirelou Thu, 11 Sep 2008 13:18:53 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385532 Of course the Chinese military have plans drawn up for Vietnamese contingency operations, but I seriously doubt they were 'leaked' to the news media. As for Vietnam being invaded throughout the centuries, they have been the invaders as often as the 'invadees'. They annihilated Champa to take what is today Central Vietnam, and then stole everything south of that from the Cambodians about the time of the 13 colonies. The one invader who left the most lasting impression on Vietnam is China, given that Chinese culture lies at the very heart of Vietnamese culture. Indeed, the threat of a possible permanent Chinese presence was what spurred 'Uncle Ho' to agree to the return of the French to Tonkin in 1945. Until recently, China could have been described as having the world's largest military museum, the PLA. That is changing and China is developing a maritime power projection capability, and appears to be improving its airborne forces. Is this cause for concern for Vietnam? Yes as regards Vietnamese claims to the Spratleys, but only to a much lesser degree as regards the survival of the Vietnamese state. Vietnam has the terrain and population to make itself a bitter pill to swallow. It could not survive an all out Chinese push to obliterate it, but it can make such an effort so potentially costly that invasion would always remain China's remedy of last resort. Of course the Chinese military have plans drawn up for Vietnamese contingency operations, but I seriously doubt they were ‘leaked’ to the news media. As for Vietnam being invaded throughout the centuries, they have been the invaders as often as the ‘invadees’. They annihilated Champa to take what is today Central Vietnam, and then stole everything south of that from the Cambodians about the time of the 13 colonies. The one invader who left the most lasting impression on Vietnam is China, given that Chinese culture lies at the very heart of Vietnamese culture. Indeed, the threat of a possible permanent Chinese presence was what spurred ‘Uncle Ho’ to agree to the return of the French to Tonkin in 1945. Until recently, China could have been described as having the world’s largest military museum, the PLA. That is changing and China is developing a maritime power projection capability, and appears to be improving its airborne forces. Is this cause for concern for Vietnam? Yes as regards Vietnamese claims to the Spratleys, but only to a much lesser degree as regards the survival of the Vietnamese state. Vietnam has the terrain and population to make itself a bitter pill to swallow. It could not survive an all out Chinese push to obliterate it, but it can make such an effort so potentially costly that invasion would always remain China’s remedy of last resort.

]]> By: Jing http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385529 Jing Thu, 11 Sep 2008 01:51:41 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385529 I've found that there is an American tendency to overplay Vietnam's strengths in the Sino-Vietnamese war of 79. Almost as if they were making up for having lost their own war with Vietnam by saying haha you lost too. The operational timetable for the war from the Chinese perspective obviously did not include time to occupy Hanoi. The Chinese objectives were twofold; to force a Vietnamese withdraw from Cambodia and to test the extent of the Soviet-Vietnamese military alliance. They failed at the former but demonstrated that the Soviets indeed were unwilling to commit their military forces directly to protect Vietnam. The "bloody nose" scenario which every tom, dick, and harry gets from the internet is based on Vietnamese claims of Chinese casualties (real reliable there) and partly on the gross ignorance of many authors when it comes to the definition of the term casualty. A casualty is a broad term that refers to killed, wounded, missing, etc. Too many people think that casualty simply refers to killed. I’ve found that there is an American tendency to overplay Vietnam’s strengths in the Sino-Vietnamese war of 79. Almost as if they were making up for having lost their own war with Vietnam by saying haha you lost too. The operational timetable for the war from the Chinese perspective obviously did not include time to occupy Hanoi. The Chinese objectives were twofold; to force a Vietnamese withdraw from Cambodia and to test the extent of the Soviet-Vietnamese military alliance. They failed at the former but demonstrated that the Soviets indeed were unwilling to commit their military forces directly to protect Vietnam.

The “bloody nose” scenario which every tom, dick, and harry gets from the internet is based on Vietnamese claims of Chinese casualties (real reliable there) and partly on the gross ignorance of many authors when it comes to the definition of the term casualty. A casualty is a broad term that refers to killed, wounded, missing, etc. Too many people think that casualty simply refers to killed.

]]> By: What If? (China invades Vietnam edition) http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385525 What If? (China invades Vietnam edition) Wed, 10 Sep 2008 15:05:59 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385525 [...] of an alleged Chinese plan to invade Vietnam, published by the South China Morning Post (hat tip: Coming Anarchy). Vietnam has formally protested to China over so-called “invasion plans” appearing on [...] [...] of an alleged Chinese plan to invade Vietnam, published by the South China Morning Post (hat tip: Coming Anarchy). Vietnam has formally protested to China over so-called âinvasion plansâ appearing on [...]

]]> By: Yours Truly http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385519 Yours Truly Wed, 10 Sep 2008 09:38:36 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385519 Dave, sorry my man. But it's real hard to find anythin' made in US or Japan these days. All of 'em corporations have all moved to China. I'm wonderin' if my BodyGlove T - shirts are even REALLY made in the US... Got to agree with you, I doubt the Mainland Chinese are so d!@#headed as to invade any of their neighboring states. They just ain't that crazy. Dave, sorry my man. But it’s real hard to find anythin’ made in US or Japan these days. All of ‘em corporations have all moved to China. I’m wonderin’ if my BodyGlove T – shirts are even REALLY made in the US…

Got to agree with you, I doubt the Mainland Chinese are so d!@#headed as to invade any of their neighboring states. They just ain’t that crazy.

]]> By: dave http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385517 dave Wed, 10 Sep 2008 06:09:48 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385517 If you want to buy product that're working good and last long try made in USA or Japan. "Made in China" don't buy it. If you want to buy product that’re working good and last long try made in USA or Japan. “Made in China” don’t buy it.

]]> By: dave http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385516 dave Wed, 10 Sep 2008 05:58:29 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385516 VN is 85million people, it can have at least 20 million soldier if China want to invade, I am sure the invader don't want to spend that much. cost too much money to get something in return. After all, Vietnamese are people with culture, not like so called "rebellious" tibetian by China, OR rebellious Georgia by the Russia whose population just a few millions to be easy harrass. I know people like to talk bullshit on the internet the facts are people with average IQ knew already. you want to know about anything go to www.wikipedia.org VN is 85million people, it can have at least 20 million
soldier if China want to invade, I am sure the invader don’t
want to spend that much. cost too much money to get something
in return. After all, Vietnamese are people with culture, not
like so called “rebellious” tibetian by China, OR rebellious
Georgia by the Russia whose population just a few millions to
be easy harrass. I know people like to talk bullshit on the internet the facts are people with average IQ knew already.
you want to know about anything go to http://www.wikipedia.org

]]> By: Mitch H. http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385507 Mitch H. Tue, 09 Sep 2008 23:07:32 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385507 Richard: That was in 1979, when the country was full of battle-hardened veterans of ten years of pitiless war with the biggest, meanest military machine on the planet. The PLA was a rotting hulk just tottering its way out of the Cultural Revolution. That outcome was overdetermined. Now? The PLA is one of the major economic players in the world economy, and the American War generation in Vietnam are antiques or dead. I wouldn't call it a rollover, but a Chinese victory might be plausible, if they caught the Vietnamese unprepared. The US certainly isn't positioned to do anything about it, I don't think. It isn't as if Vietnam was an island... Richard: That was in 1979, when the country was full of battle-hardened veterans of ten years of pitiless war with the biggest, meanest military machine on the planet. The PLA was a rotting hulk just tottering its way out of the Cultural Revolution. That outcome was overdetermined.

Now? The PLA is one of the major economic players in the world economy, and the American War generation in Vietnam are antiques or dead. I wouldn’t call it a rollover, but a Chinese victory might be plausible, if they caught the Vietnamese unprepared. The US certainly isn’t positioned to do anything about it, I don’t think. It isn’t as if Vietnam was an island…

]]> By: Rommel http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385468 Rommel Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:19:55 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385468 At the risk of baiting... Euv, you are either a Chinese nationalist troll or you are a troll of an even sadder breed.. Either way your comment was crass and disrespectful to say the least and its kind has no place in this gentleman's forum. That said, ElamBend, in his geo-politically learned ways needs no defense by me and I would wager he is dignified enough to ignore your ignorant drivel. At the risk of baiting…

Euv, you are either a Chinese nationalist troll or you are a troll of an even sadder breed..
Either way your comment was crass and disrespectful to say the least and its kind has no place in this gentleman’s forum.
That said, ElamBend, in his geo-politically learned ways needs no defense by me and I would wager he is dignified enough to ignore your ignorant drivel.

]]> By: dave http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385461 dave Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:13:50 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385461 War sounds like fun to me when talking about it, but when it happens and someone die especially some of your relative die it's not fun anymore. War sounds like fun to me when talking about it, but when it
happens and someone die especially some of your relative die
it’s not fun anymore.

]]> By: permaterry http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385458 permaterry Mon, 08 Sep 2008 14:42:14 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385458 Invaders throughout the centuries have tried Viet Nam on. They're still there. Invaders throughout the centuries have tried Viet Nam on. They’re still there.

]]> By: Euv http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385453 Euv Mon, 08 Sep 2008 13:02:01 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385453 hey Elambend, did u no dat taiwan is part of China? idiots these days... hey Elambend, did u no dat taiwan is part of China?
idiots these days…

]]> By: Jing http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385442 Jing Mon, 08 Sep 2008 02:45:42 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385442 Both Curzon. Actually Aceface I was referring to this. http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5j2rw7qqR9vew-eOrGCoDgp6S69Kw and this. http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/china-protests-inspire-vietnamese/ Both Curzon.

Actually Aceface I was referring to this.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5j2rw7qqR9vew-eOrGCoDgp6S69Kw

and this.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/china-protests-inspire-vietnamese/

]]> By: Richard http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385431 Richard Sun, 07 Sep 2008 16:33:18 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385431 In Feb of 1979 the Chinese DID invade Vietnam and got a bloody nose in the process.. perhaps as many as 13000 dead. In Feb of 1979 the Chinese DID invade Vietnam and got a bloody nose in the process.. perhaps as many as 13000 dead.

]]> By: B http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385428 B Sun, 07 Sep 2008 15:20:03 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385428 Some (although obviously not all) Mainland students studying abroad are on government scholarships and I've heard rumours that many are actively encouraged to participate in such matters of national importance (like sticking it to the Japanese while in a foreign country). Some (although obviously not all) Mainland students studying abroad are on government scholarships and I’ve heard rumours that many are actively encouraged to participate in such matters of national importance (like sticking it to the Japanese while in a foreign country).

]]> By: Aceface http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385423 Aceface Sun, 07 Sep 2008 13:36:18 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385423 This is better.From Reuters "Anti-Japanese Protests Held at Japanese Embassy in Vietnam Apr. 17, 2005 7:03pm JST HANOI (4/17, Reuters) Anti-Japanese protests were held in front of the Japanese embassy in Vietnam’s capital city Hanoi. Wearing headbands, the participants shouted anti-Japanese slogans into bullhorns and waved banners written in English and Chinese characters. One of the banners read “Japan get out!” The demonstrators are said to be expatriate Chinese living in Vietnam." This is better.From Reuters

“Anti-Japanese Protests Held at Japanese Embassy in Vietnam
Apr. 17, 2005 7:03pm JST

HANOI (4/17, Reuters) Anti-Japanese protests were held in front of the Japanese embassy in Vietnamâs capital city Hanoi.

Wearing headbands, the participants shouted anti-Japanese slogans into bullhorns and waved banners written in English and Chinese characters. One of the banners read âJapan get out!â

The demonstrators are said to be expatriate Chinese living in Vietnam.”

]]> By: Aceface http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385421 Aceface Sun, 07 Sep 2008 13:20:33 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385421 Fenquing? Unleashed in Hanoi? I've heard that one before.... http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2005-04/18/content_2844015.htm "To defend everything is defend nothing" indeed.... Fenquing? Unleashed in Hanoi?
I’ve heard that one before….
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2005-04/18/content_2844015.htm

“To defend everything is defend nothing” indeed….

]]> By: Curzon http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385419 Curzon Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:36:01 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385419 Jing, is your point that the invading Vietnam is not Beijing's policy, or that the Vietnamese are getting a dose of what they deserve? Jing, is your point that the invading Vietnam is not Beijing’s policy, or that the Vietnamese are getting a dose of what they deserve?

]]> By: Jing http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/comment-page-1/#comment-385417 Jing Sun, 07 Sep 2008 11:23:56 +0000 http://cominganarchy.com/2008/09/06/china-to-invade-vietnam/#comment-385417 Your point, Curzon? To defend everything is to defend nothing. Censors will only be active on topics which they feel undermine the legitimacy of the state and party. Pot & Kettle from Vietnam. Considering they routinely unleash their own fenqing at the Chinese embassy with chants of "dey tuk ur Land!" whenever they wish. Your point, Curzon? To defend everything is to defend nothing. Censors will only be active on topics which they feel undermine the legitimacy of the state and party.

Pot & Kettle from Vietnam. Considering they routinely unleash their own fenqing at the Chinese embassy with chants of “dey tuk ur Land!” whenever they wish.

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