What do I mean by that?

Speaking Victorian: “Our actions are limited in time, territory and mission,” said Russia’s envoy to NATO, Dmitry Rogozin.

Thinking Pagan: Russia has rejected a Georgian-proposed ceasefire, is attaching Georgian targets outside outside South Ossetia, blockading the Georgian coast, and rejecting international mediation. Analaysts say that Moscow is pushing for the strongest position to carry out negotiations.

As the Russian army pushed its way into South Ossetia, Georgia’s weary troops fled south with whatever they could carry. As Russia pushes out of southern Ossetia into Georgia proper, the feeling by many, especially the Georgia military, is that they have been betrayed.

“Where were our friends?” Troops pushing south seemed to expect that the United States was coming to their aid, and NATO help was on its way. Georgia, after all, has one of the highest numbers of soldiers in Iraq per capita (recalled yesterday), the capital has a George W. Bush Street, and since the Rose Revolution, the leaders of the respective countries have gushed over each other. But that the West is pushing for diplomacy as a solution basically means that Georgia has to eat whatever Russian-backed separatism exists in their territory.

For the Ossetians, trapped between Russia and Georgia, Russian help is welcome, and Georgian “aggression” in their territory is labeled as the responsibility of the United States. Of course, its lack of involvement at this stage is only being noticed by Georgia, not the Ossetians.

As for reports on the ground, you’ve got to wonder what you can trust (ironically, both of the articles below have the same general text):

*- In South Ossetia capital, a relative calmLA Times

*- Chaos reigns in Georgian rebel city after battle – Reuters


COMMENTS / 21 COMMENTS

[...] Coming Anarchy, “Russia Is Speaking Victorian and Thinking Pagan” [...]

The Glittering Eye » Blog Archive » Watcher’s Council Nominations added these pithy words on Aug 13 08 at 11:44 am

[...] Coming Anarchy “Russia Is Speaking Victorian and Thinking Pagan” [...]

Cheat Seeking Missiles » Wednesday Reading added these pithy words on Aug 13 08 at 2:27 pm

[...] Coming Anarchy “Russia Is Speaking Victorian and Thinking Pagan” [...]

Bookworm Room » Watching those Weasels added these pithy words on Aug 13 08 at 5:24 pm

And Russia is afraid of NATO? Why? It has now proven itself to be a worthless organization that exists to do nothing but standardize military regulations, promote common defense markets and hardware, and generate bureaucracy. It has done nothing to help this country who, in one of the most dangerous neighborhoods on earth, stuck its neck out for us. Shame on NATO. Shame on my own country, the USA. Shame. What a sad day this is.

Arcane added these pithy words on 11 Aug 08 at 5:52 am

Let’s ask the basic question. Why are some collapsed countries’ internal borders sacrosanct and others are not?

Oliver added these pithy words on 11 Aug 08 at 2:26 pm

@Oliver

I agree in theory, but insofar as Ivan is concerned, he has invaded every country on his border, and has a different conception of such nuanced international legal terms as “citizenship,” “nation,” “offensive forces,” and “treaty.” Don’t suppose Daghestan and Chechnya have received the same options for statehood as South Ossetia or Abkhazia “should.” These are merely Russian settlements from the fascist Soviet policies on race.

Very unfortunately, Georgia is not yet a part of NATO, and the US and her shamefully cowardly European allies are in no mood for WWI-style diplomacy. The question to be asked here is: where is Georgia to turn, is she cannot turn to the West?

Were it not for the absurd world energy policy promoted by the United States, and enjoyed by the rest of the world, the axis of rogue states, embodied by OPEC-nations and the neo Soviet Union—embassadors and protectors of every dictatorship on the earth—would have no means to engage in such brash fascism (as we also observe from the Arab-supported arabized Sudanese government).

This is an embarrassment to the United States and Germany, but more so to those who believed that Russia’s government was anything more than a KGB-run neo-Soviet Union. The Soviets have transplanted local peoples with their own throughout the Soviet-occupied sphere, including, but not limited to, Prussia, Poland-Lithuania, Belarus, the Ukraine, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Turkestan, and Moldova. Having failed to fully settle Georgia, the fascists have mailed out passports to separatists, who themselves have as their prime minister a Russian settler.

This continued displacement of decent peoples from Europe by the Soviets is disgusting. Had the US taken the advice of Patton in 1945, there would be no EU rebuilding in Breslau, Posen, Danzig, Koenigsberg, Allenstein, and the like, nor in the Polish holdings of Minsk, Lviv, Chirnivtsi, etc., nor anywhere in Austria-Hungary. Had the Europeans any sense or decency, they would support the US against barbarians.

Shockingly, the only ones acting beyond expectation in this circumstance, are the French, who are at least not supporting the Soviets. The US must begin as a strategic hedge against the communists, to move its bases eastwards, and forget this absurd idea of Turkish EU membership, but rather initiate a policy Turkestan unification.

Augustinus von Moltke added these pithy words on 11 Aug 08 at 5:45 pm

@ Arcane “one of the most dangerous neighborhoods on earth, stuck its neck out for us.”

That’s the Israeli meme and even though the Georgia situation is analogous to Israel, I don’t think the meme is transferable. Even if it were, it cheapens the meme and leads to confusion in the natives who then might start asking questions. You wouldn’t want that.

Jesus Reyes added these pithy words on 11 Aug 08 at 6:53 pm

The only one talking about Israel here is you, Reyes. Get with the program.

Arcane added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 5:59 am

In which sense did Georgia stick out its neck for NATO? It deployed a token force to Afghanistan and that’s it.

Oliver added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 6:18 am

Georgia deployed 2,000 troops to Iraq to help the U.S. That’s where the majority of her support was.

Besides, your logic is faulty Oliver. Since most European countries in NATO haven’t deployed troops to Afghanistan, are you saying you would do nothing for them if they got attacked? You’re just building strawmen.

Arcane added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 7:49 am

I remember reading also that Georgia had the highest deployment in Iraq per capita of national population at one time. Certainly they felt that they were owed a certain level of protection and guarantee from the US and the West as a whole for their participation.

I understand the WWI logic for not getting involved here, but the US had better pray that Russia ends its expansion with South Ossetia and Abkhazia. If they try regime change or full-fledged occupation it will seriously hurt US standing among similarly geopolitically situated countries such as Mongolia, Yemen, Qatar, and other vulnerable states across the globe that have thrown their lot in with the US.

Curzon added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 8:05 am

Georgia has stuck it head out for itself and everyone else as an independent democratic nation with the right to have free elections and less corruption, regardless of the orthogonality of such to Russian policy.

I was lucky to see the President Traian Basescu of Romanian give a lecture before a relatively small audience, in which he (without notes) discussed the need to internationalize the Black Sea, which is presently Russian territorial water. In this case, Basescu—who was impeached by the remaining corrupt Sovietized political bloc in Romania, but reinstated by a plebiscite—was seeking to control a seemingly endless flow of heroin and other drugs, weapons, and sexual slaves through the Black Sea corridor, another aspect of Russian policy.

Not only must the Black Sea be wrested from the Russian mafia, but Turkestan must me pursued to hedge Russian influence in the oil and gas markets, as well as to serve as a bulwark against further Russian expansionism and malfeasance.

Augustinus von Moltke added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 8:26 am

The US and NATO—indeed the European appeasers—must also act to protect democracy and an ally. It is an embarrassment that we have abandoned the Georgians.

Augustinus von Moltke added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 8:28 am

Didn’t the Georgians start the war?

SH added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 3:56 pm

I am afraid I have to remind you that Iraq is not a NATO operation. To the US that might not matter. To the rest of NATO it does matter.

Oliver added these pithy words on 12 Aug 08 at 8:10 pm

I feel bad for Georgia, but there is little the US can, or should, do. The 2,000 soldiers in Iraq was appreciated and the US has helped with training and aid and worked to integrate Georgia with the West. But it was always going to be decades long process.

We should help Georgia as much as we can, but Georgia can’t seriously expect direct military intervention by the US against Russia. Starting World War III would be insane beyond belief.

We should step up economic, military, and political links with Georgia (once the dust settles) and the other former Soviet satellites like Ukraine. Ukraine is the big prize being fought over, keeping her free and out of Russian hands should be the strategic goal.

jim added these pithy words on 13 Aug 08 at 3:22 am

Funny words—in the blog. Invasion, democracy etc. Need to define the terms. Need to apply the definition strictly to all – especially to the US.
Isn’t the rush to grab Iraq’s oil by the US an ‘invasion’? How can bail-outs of collapsing investment banks / Freddie Mac etc. be ‘market economics’?
Americans—either be consistent or stop preaching!

Man added these pithy words on 13 Aug 08 at 11:20 am

Uh, of course the invasion of Iraq was an “invasion.” Who has refused to call it otherwise? You guys just love strawmen!

Arcane added these pithy words on 14 Aug 08 at 12:52 am

I am afraid I have to remind you that Iraq is not a NATO operation. To the US that might not matter. To the rest of NATO it does matter.

You obviously didn’t finish reading my first reply to you, or else you would not have answered so incoherently.

Arcane added these pithy words on 14 Aug 08 at 12:59 am

I did. I did not want to start a discussion about the future of NATO here. But if you wish so, very well. An alliance can in the long run only exist if all members contribute. So if NATO countries refuse to fight in a case of defense, the alliance will eventually collapse.

Oliver added these pithy words on 14 Aug 08 at 9:23 am

Stop feeding the rats.
Here’s a better option:

http://bumperstickers.cafepress.com/item/just-dont-vote-bumper-sticker/302216775

Donnie added these pithy words on 07 Sep 08 at 2:50 pm

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Russia is Speaking Victorian and Thinking Pagan

Posted on 11 Aug 08 by Curzon. Subscribe to follow comments on this post. 21 comments. Add your thoughts or trackback from your own site.

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