Comments on: “Kenya now reminds me of 1994 Rwanda…”

By: random african

random african — Sun, 03 Feb 2008 04:27:30 +0000

First of all, IN is right: the Rwanda comparision doesn’t make any sort of sense. The numbers and the mind-state are very different.

And yes, Ethnic issues in Kenya don’t say much about the rest of Africa. For one, Kenya’s ethnic situation has been, for a bunch of reasons, one of the worse on the continent. And that among other things is why it has been ranking very high on the Failed State Index for a while. Now when Tanzania or Senegal degenerates in ethnic violence, you can say “it can happen anywhere”.

But at the end of it, the ethnic part of it is somehow overestimated. The tensions and conflicts that are now coming to the surface thanks to a rigged election and a weak democracy are really about land, politics, control of ressources, control of the state, not in “tribes”, even if they express themselves that way.

But the most important thing is that the Kenyan stable democracy has never existed.

By: dj

dj — Sun, 03 Feb 2008 00:14:24 +0000

You guys make some good points. If these places are going to work as Nation-States the nationalism part of it needs to develop. Multiculturalism with parity of numbers between different sides will just lead to this no matter what the level of economic development is.

By: IN

IN — Sat, 02 Feb 2008 18:07:48 +0000

Denmark and Portugal(and most European countries are mono-ethnic states formed and administered (mostly) through a(consensual)social contract. As the last century has shown us, Europeans, placed in the same situation would react in much the same way!

By: Curzon

Curzon — Sat, 02 Feb 2008 06:32:14 +0000

Adrian: I see your point, but I think that we’re now beyond thinking that the the viscious ethnic violence resulting in civil war over the past 15 years in DRC, Liberia, Sierra Leone, and Rwanda are isolated cases. People have long talked about the similar potential for violence in places like Guinea-Bissau and Chad and Nigeria, I’ve never heard anyone say that Kenya was on the verge of a tribal meltdown. That this can happen in Kenya DOES show

Yes, the Europe had Ireland in the 1980s and the Balkans in the 1990s, and other notable ongoing tensions in places such as northern Spain. But it wouldn’t be until you saw ethnic cleansing in Denmark and Portugal that I’d have the same fears I have about Africa.

By: Michael

Michael — Fri, 01 Feb 2008 21:55:18 +0000

I wonder what this will do to Uganda’a and Tanzania’s ability to contribute to UN and AU peacekeeping missions? I don’t see them considering donations of troops to faraway problems when their next-door neighbor is disintegrating.

By: Adrian

Adrian — Fri, 01 Feb 2008 20:37:20 +0000

But IN, those countries are too dangerous for journalists to travel too! Thus they are not as important…

I take issue with this statement:

“That Kenya, long heralded as an “African success story” because of a so-called stable democracy with a growing economy, is facing tribal violence reminiscent of Rwanda shows how little hope there is in much of the African heartland.”

Did the collapse of Yugoslavia, or the bloody coup in Romania show how little hope there is for Europe? Perhaps the violence in Columbia shows how the entire continent of South America is going down the tubes? Kenya’s problems are Kenya’s (and even confined to a part of Kenya), not all of Africa’s. For instance I haven’t seen any reports of the violence spreading across the border into Tanzania, despite shared ethnicities.

By: IN

IN — Fri, 01 Feb 2008 12:58:05 +0000

around 800 people have died in Kenya over the last month.

45,000 people are dying in Congo every month…800,000 people died in Rwanda(about 260,000 a month). Somalia has lost thousands over the last couple of moths. About 500,000 have died in Darfur!

Just thought i’d put things in perspective!

By: dj

dj — Fri, 01 Feb 2008 08:38:18 +0000

I recall a BBC report in December stated that Machete sales went through the roof that month prior to the elections. Aside from the police and army using firearms is most of this violence committed with Machetes and burning things down?