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	<title>Comments on: The ocean is becoming&#160;wild</title>
	<atom:link href="http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/</link>
	<description>Speak Victorian, Think Pagan</description>
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		<title>By: jomama</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379799</link>
		<dc:creator>jomama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Sep 2007 12:57:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379799</guid>
		<description>It seems no major state -- or upcoming one -- will ever get the idea
that the hubris that yields the bandying about of large military forces is usually &lt;a href=&quot;http://djomama.blogspot.com/2006/12/first-world-government-junk-bonds-on.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;
their undoing.&lt;/a&gt;  That&#039;s not to say that the factors leading to that aren&#039;t
a great part of it.

Coming anarchy indeed.

When will a state emerge that has no such hubris, letting the rest
spend themselves poor?  Ah, but such intelligence is not inherent 
in force-based systems so we can forget that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems no major state &#8212; or upcoming one &#8212; will ever get the idea<br />
that the hubris that yields the bandying about of large military forces is usually <a href="http://djomama.blogspot.com/2006/12/first-world-government-junk-bonds-on.html"><br />
their undoing.</a>  That&#8217;s not to say that the factors leading to that aren&#8217;t<br />
a great part of it.</p>

<p>Coming anarchy indeed.</p>

<p>When will a state emerge that has no such hubris, letting the rest<br />
spend themselves poor?  Ah, but such intelligence is not inherent <br />
in force-based systems so we can forget that.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: IJ</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379704</link>
		<dc:creator>IJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Sep 2007 10:46:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379704</guid>
		<description>Robert Kaplan writes: &lt;i&gt;In a post-George W. Bush America, if we do not find a way to agree on basic precepts, Iraq may indeed turn out to have been the event that signaled our military decline. Preventing that will require continued high military expenditures combined with &lt;b&gt;an unrelenting multilateralism&lt;/b&gt;of a sort we have not pursued since the 1990s.&lt;/i&gt;

But Kaplan seriously caveats high military expenditures: &lt;i&gt;Military power rests substantially on the willingness to use it: perhaps less so in war than in peacetime as a means of leverage and coercion. That, in turn, requires a vigorous nationalism â€” something that is far more noticeable right now in Asia than in parts of an increasingly post-national West.&lt;/i&gt;

This leaves &quot;unrelenting multilateralism&quot; as his preference. 
  
The President of the US seems now to be following this reasoning - yesterday at the United Nations: &lt;a href=&quot;http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1537652007&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The president, who once boasted that the US was strong enough to go it alone, said: &lt;b&gt;&quot;The US is committed to a strong and vibrant United Nations.&quot;&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robert Kaplan writes: <i>In a post-George W. Bush America, if we do not find a way to agree on basic precepts, Iraq may indeed turn out to have been the event that signaled our military decline. Preventing that will require continued high military expenditures combined with <b>an unrelenting multilateralism</b>of a sort we have not pursued since the 1990s.</i></p>

<p>But Kaplan seriously caveats high military expenditures: <i>Military power rests substantially on the willingness to use it: perhaps less so in war than in peacetime as a means of leverage and coercion. That, in turn, requires a vigorous nationalism &acirc;€” something that is far more noticeable right now in Asia than in parts of an increasingly post-national West.</i></p>

<p>This leaves &#8220;unrelenting multilateralism&#8221; as his preference. <br />
  <br />
The President of the US seems now to be following this reasoning &#8211; yesterday at the United Nations: <a href="http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1537652007">The president, who once boasted that the US was strong enough to go it alone, said: <b>&#8220;The US is committed to a strong and vibrant United Nations.&#8221;</b></a></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lexington Green</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379661</link>
		<dc:creator>Lexington Green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 00:04:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379661</guid>
		<description>I have to disagree with El Jefe.  Defense spending is, first and foremost, SPENDING.  The Democrats especially under President Hillary will want to prove they are &quot;tough&quot; on Defense.  Spending money on defense will be one way to do that.  Defense spending will grow under the next administration, no matter who it is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to disagree with El Jefe.  Defense spending is, first and foremost, <span class="caps">SPENDING. </span> The Democrats especially under President Hillary will want to prove they are &#8220;tough&#8221; on Defense.  Spending money on defense will be one way to do that.  Defense spending will grow under the next administration, no matter who it is.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: El Jefe Maximo</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379644</link>
		<dc:creator>El Jefe Maximo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 19:45:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379644</guid>
		<description>Given the probable outcome of the next US presidential election (to say nothing of the likely makeup of Congress): I don&#039;t see any possibility that US naval and air forces will receive the refurbishment they so desperately need. Anti-US powers are likely to have things pretty much their own way for awhile. If you&#039;re looking for 1930&#039;s analogies for what&#039;s coming in the US, try a Stanley Baldwin-like view of national defense.

I wonder to what extent this possibility might drive armaments on the part of other powers, particularly Japan ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given the probable outcome of the next US presidential election (to say nothing of the likely makeup of Congress): I don&#8217;t see any possibility that US naval and air forces will receive the refurbishment they so desperately need. Anti-US powers are likely to have things pretty much their own way for awhile. If you&#8217;re looking for 1930&#8217;s analogies for what&#8217;s coming in the <span class="caps">US, </span>try a Stanley Baldwin-like view of national defense.</p>

<p>I wonder to what extent this possibility might drive armaments on the part of other powers, particularly Japan ?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: feeblemind</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379604</link>
		<dc:creator>feeblemind</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 02:37:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379604</guid>
		<description>Good link. Thought provoking article by Kaplan. But I think the key question is which way the USA will tack?  Will the USA see a series of appeasers in the President&#039;s office? Demographics: What happens after the Baby Boomers die off? Which way will the USA go then?  Either the USA will continue to stand up to China or they won&#039;t. The smaller players will have to look after their own self-interest in that context.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good link. Thought provoking article by Kaplan. But I think the key question is which way the <span class="caps">USA </span>will tack?  Will the <span class="caps">USA </span>see a series of appeasers in the President&#8217;s office? Demographics: What happens after the Baby Boomers die off? Which way will the <span class="caps">USA </span>go then?  Either the <span class="caps">USA </span>will continue to stand up to China or they won&#8217;t. The smaller players will have to look after their own self-interest in that context.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Left Flank &#187; That Old Kaplan Magic</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379575</link>
		<dc:creator>Left Flank &#187; That Old Kaplan Magic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Sep 2007 13:57:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379575</guid>
		<description>[...] tackling William James. Style defeats categorization. My Kaplan is not your Kaplan. Just check out Younghusband and Lexington Green on the same [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] tackling William James. Style defeats categorization. My Kaplan is not your Kaplan. Just check out Younghusband and Lexington Green on the same [...]</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lexington Green</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/comment-page-1/#comment-379526</link>
		<dc:creator>Lexington Green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Sep 2007 20:53:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cominganarchy.com/2007/09/22/the-ocean-is-becoming-wild/#comment-379526</guid>
		<description>&quot;...subtlety must guide America&#039;s hand as the only power in the Pacific without territorial desires.&quot;

This should allow us to be the &quot;offshore&quot; balancer in Asia for a long time, much as Perfidious Albion was able to do in Europe, to the perpetual irritation and resentment of the landpowers, scorpions trapped in a bottle who have nowhere to go, while the island power can take to the sea (and air and space) and come ashore at times and places of its own choosing.

BTW, I got halfway through Kaplan&#039;s new book today, and even though I had read a lot of it in the Atlantic, it is terrific.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;subtlety must guide America&#8217;s hand as the only power in the Pacific without territorial desires.&#8221;</p>

<p>This should allow us to be the &#8220;offshore&#8221; balancer in Asia for a long time, much as Perfidious Albion was able to do in Europe, to the perpetual irritation and resentment of the landpowers, scorpions trapped in a bottle who have nowhere to go, while the island power can take to the sea (and air and space) and come ashore at times and places of its own choosing.</p>

<p><span class="caps">BTW,</span> I got halfway through Kaplan&#8217;s new book today, and even though I had read a lot of it in the Atlantic, it is terrific.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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