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	<title>Comments on: Chirol&#8217;s Take on a 51st&#160;State</title>
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	<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/</link>
	<description>Speak Victorian, Think Pagan</description>
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		<title>By: Wilma Cadilla</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-2/#comment-238932</link>
		<dc:creator>Wilma Cadilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 14:03:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-238932</guid>
		<description>Sorry, snow......   it just doesn&#039;t work that way, but we are certainly working on it.......  this issue is not as simple as some might think,.....

We do need congressional approval on a local plebisicite simply because local government officials will do everything they can to stop the process and include the current status, which is totally unacceptable for us and is the reason why statehood has not advanced.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, snow&#8230;&#8230;   it just doesn&#8217;t work that way, but we are certainly working on it&#8230;&#8230;.  this issue is not as simple as some might think,&#8230;..</p>

<p>We do need congressional approval on a local plebisicite simply because local government officials will do everything they can to stop the process and include the current status, which is totally unacceptable for us and is the reason why statehood has not advanced.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: snow</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-2/#comment-238826</link>
		<dc:creator>snow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:04:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Sorry, am I missing something here? It seems that Lirelou and others have pointed out several times that the ball is in Puerto Rico&#039;s court. Vote for joining the US as a state and it will happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, am I missing something here? It seems that Lirelou and others have pointed out several times that the ball is in Puerto Rico&#8217;s court. Vote for joining the US as a state and it will happen.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Norika Rodriguez</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-2/#comment-237997</link>
		<dc:creator>Norika Rodriguez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:59:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-237997</guid>
		<description>Dear Mr. Chirols:

I&#039;m a 41 years old US citizen who resides in Puerto Rico. I&#039;m not a politician; I&#039;m a woman, a wife, a mother, a professional&quot;Ã‚Â¦ a common citizen.

For 109 years the people of Puerto Rico have heard from the different Presidents and Congressmen that the United States of America believes that the four million disenfranchised American citizens residing in Puerto Rico have the right to a permanent and fully democratic status of their choice. Now, that the President&#039;s Task Force on Puerto Rico&#039;s Status has given three recommendations for Puerto Rico&#039;s future status and relationship with the United States, again I&#039;m asking myself if the new #110 Congressmen are going to help the Puerto Rican people solve what I understand is our nowadays biggest problem - the solution of the Puerto Rico&#039;s status &quot;â€œ enabling Puerto Ricans to choose among realistic options.

The following arguments have been heard for years by the people of Puerto Rico and are very similar to those of millions of Puerto Ricans who believe in the US Nation and in the Statehood for Puerto Rico:

1. That the American history is the story of a diverse people striving to realize our ideals: a common dream of equality, and opportunity, freedom and community. That you believe in a better America, more equal, more free, more American.

I have always believed that the US Nation is based in the diversity of races, cultures, political and religious believes&quot;Ã‚Â¦ and that these are the most important components of what the words equality and freedom mean for most of the American people&quot;Ã‚Â¦ except for the approximately four millions of Puerto Ricans who resides in this 100 x 35 Island. Equality? Freedom? Do you really think that we, the people of Puerto Rico, can feel more equal, more free, more American, when we don&#039;t have the same rights as Puerto Ricans who resides in the Mainland?

2. That your commitment to civil rights is ironclad.

I hope that #110 Congressmen commitment to civil rights don&#039;t be another promise. They have to know that the USA Mainland have four million of American citizens whose rights are transgressed with every sunset, only because we don&#039;t reside in the Mainland; and that we will continue fighting to obtain the equality that we deserve.

3. That US is a nation of immigrants, and from Arab-Americans in California to Latinos in Florida, we share the dream of a better life in the country we love.

&quot;I have a dream&quot;Ã‚Â¦&quot;Ã‚?. I&#039;m sure you have read and heard these words, because they are part of the US Nation history. Let me re-use some of the words of the August 28, 1963, Marthin Luther King&#039;s speech to dramatize my dream and the dream of thousands of Puerto Ricans: &quot;But one hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans still are not free. One hundred years later, the life of the Puerto Ricans is still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination. One hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans live on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity. One hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans are still languished in the corners of American society and find themselves an exile in his own land. And so I come here today to dramatize a shameful condition&quot;Ã‚?. Fourty-four years ago, Marthin Luther King, Jr., had a dream&quot;Ã‚Â¦ Nowadays, I have a dream, too&quot;Ã‚Â¦ 

4. That voting is the foundation of democracy, a central act of civic engagement, and an expression of equal citizenship. Voting rights are important precisely because they are protective of all other rights.

Puerto Ricans have been statutory US citizens since 1917. As I&#039;m sure you know, that means that our future US citizenship and nationality is not guaranteed. When Puerto Rico became a Commonwealth in 1952, it meant that Puerto Ricans could vote for our governor and other Puerto Rican government posts, but not for the US President. Also, there is a non-voting representative in Congress from Puerto Rico. If the #110 Congressmen really believe that voting is the foundation of democracy, why, at the 21st. Century, the US Nation has approximately four millions of US citizens who do not have the right to vote for the President and Congressmen who make the laws that affect their life and future?

5. That you will hasten family reunification for parents and children, husbands and wives.

As you may know, currently half of Puerto Ricans reside in the Mainland, and the other half in the Island. This is because since 1898, when Puerto Rico became a territory of the United States, Puerto Ricans have lived 109 year tradition of cultural integration with Mainland society and have looked for a better future for our families, seeing the US Nation as one of freedom and equality. But nowadays, Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island still deal with social, educational, language, housing, and employment discrimination&quot;Ã‚Â¦ Why?

6. That you are committed to equal treatment of all service members and believe all patriotic Americans should be allowed to serve our country without discrimination, persecution or violence.

Puerto Ricans have served in the US Armed Forces since 1917. In all the wars in which the US has been involved, the participation of Puerto Rico has been greater than that of 22 states of the Union. Over 225,000 Puerto Ricans have fought in all US wars since World War I. More than 2,000 have been killed in action; more than 3,000 wounded, and hundreds have remained disabled for life. Four Puerto Ricans have received the Congressional Medal of Honor for heroism. As it was the case in the past, during the present state of war in which our Nation finds itself fighting the savage and cowardly terrorists, Puerto Ricans are voluntarily offering to serve and the members of our National Guard and Reserve Components are responding to the call of duty (as up today 55 Puerto Ricans soldiers have died in the Irak war). The above could not be more eloquent evidence of the trust and confidence which the US has placed in Puerto Ricans. The US Nation has a debt with all of those Puerto Ricans who, throughout these 109 years, have served in the US Armed Forces. It has to be #110 Congressmen responsibility to work for obtaining for them the 100% of the benefits they deserve under the federal and state laws.

7. That for all those who live under our flag, you support strong economic development and fair and equitable treatment under federal programs.

For 109 years, as a US territory the Commonwealth of PR has had a poor economic growth if we compared it with the 50 states, and the difference between the Island and the States is wider with every sunset. In the past 30 years, the Island&#039;s economy has decreased and continues decreasing. Nor the lower federal benefits nor the income tax exemptions that PR receives have been sufficient to obtain the expected growth rate. Under the Commonwealth, PR has not been able to close the difference between it and the poorest states of the US Nation. Our labor force participation is under the Arkansas, Mississippi and North Carolina ones; our unemployment rate is twice the US; our poverty indicators are near the 50%, and our older citizens receive pensions under the average of the 50 states. In summary, Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island have more difficulty to obtain a job; when we find one, we receive a lower salary, and when we retire, we receive fewer benefits compared with the Puerto Ricans who reside in the Mainland. As you may see, as a territory Puerto Ricans will never reach our objective to obtain greater levels of income and economic growth because of the limitations this condition imposes us.

&quot;The future does not belong to fear; it belongs to the freedom&quot;Ã‚?. It&#039;s time, Mr. Chirols, that the new #110 US Congressmen give Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island the opportunity to choose among realistic permanent and fully democratic status options.

Sincerely,

Norika RodrÃƒÆ’Ã‚Â­guez Carmona
US citizen who resides in Puerto Rico
Santa Juana IV
X2 10A St.
Caguas, PR USA  00725-2081</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mr. Chirols:</p>

<p>I&#8217;m a 41 years old US citizen who resides in Puerto Rico. I&#8217;m not a politician; I&#8217;m a woman, a wife, a mother, a professional&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; a common citizen.</p>

<p>For 109 years the people of Puerto Rico have heard from the different Presidents and Congressmen that the United States of America believes that the four million disenfranchised American citizens residing in Puerto Rico have the right to a permanent and fully democratic status of their choice. Now, that the President&#8217;s Task Force on Puerto Rico&#8217;s Status has given three recommendations for Puerto Rico&#8217;s future status and relationship with the United States, again I&#8217;m asking myself if the new #110 Congressmen are going to help the Puerto Rican people solve what I understand is our nowadays biggest problem &#8211; the solution of the Puerto Rico&#8217;s status &#8220;&acirc;€œ enabling Puerto Ricans to choose among realistic options.</p>

<p>The following arguments have been heard for years by the people of Puerto Rico and are very similar to those of millions of Puerto Ricans who believe in the US Nation and in the Statehood for Puerto Rico:</p>

<p>1. That the American history is the story of a diverse people striving to realize our ideals: a common dream of equality, and opportunity, freedom and community. That you believe in a better America, more equal, more free, more American.</p>

<p>I have always believed that the US Nation is based in the diversity of races, cultures, political and religious believes&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; and that these are the most important components of what the words equality and freedom mean for most of the American people&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; except for the approximately four millions of Puerto Ricans who resides in this 100 &#215; 35 Island. Equality? Freedom? Do you really think that we, the people of Puerto Rico, can feel more equal, more free, more American, when we don&#8217;t have the same rights as Puerto Ricans who resides in the Mainland?</p>

<p>2. That your commitment to civil rights is ironclad.</p>

<p>I hope that #110 Congressmen commitment to civil rights don&#8217;t be another promise. They have to know that the <span class="caps">USA</span> Mainland have four million of American citizens whose rights are transgressed with every sunset, only because we don&#8217;t reside in the Mainland; and that we will continue fighting to obtain the equality that we deserve.</p>

<p>3. That US is a nation of immigrants, and from Arab-Americans in California to Latinos in Florida, we share the dream of a better life in the country we love.</p>

<p>&#8220;I have a dream&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar;&#8221;&Atilde;‚?. I&#8217;m sure you have read and heard these words, because they are part of the US Nation history. Let me re-use some of the words of the August 28, 1963, Marthin Luther King&#8217;s speech to dramatize my dream and the dream of thousands of Puerto Ricans: &#8220;But one hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans still are not free. One hundred years later, the life of the Puerto Ricans is still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination. One hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans live on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity. One hundred years later, the Puerto Ricans are still languished in the corners of American society and find themselves an exile in his own land. And so I come here today to dramatize a shameful condition&#8221;&Atilde;‚?. Fourty-four years ago, Marthin Luther King, Jr., had a dream&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; Nowadays, I have a dream, too&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; </p>

<p>4. That voting is the foundation of democracy, a central act of civic engagement, and an expression of equal citizenship. Voting rights are important precisely because they are protective of all other rights.</p>

<p>Puerto Ricans have been statutory US citizens since 1917. As I&#8217;m sure you know, that means that our future US citizenship and nationality is not guaranteed. When Puerto Rico became a Commonwealth in 1952, it meant that Puerto Ricans could vote for our governor and other Puerto Rican government posts, but not for the US President. Also, there is a non-voting representative in Congress from Puerto Rico. If the #110 Congressmen really believe that voting is the foundation of democracy, why, at the 21st. Century, the US Nation has approximately four millions of US citizens who do not have the right to vote for the President and Congressmen who make the laws that affect their life and future?</p>

<p>5. That you will hasten family reunification for parents and children, husbands and wives.</p>

<p>As you may know, currently half of Puerto Ricans reside in the Mainland, and the other half in the Island. This is because since 1898, when Puerto Rico became a territory of the United States, Puerto Ricans have lived 109 year tradition of cultural integration with Mainland society and have looked for a better future for our families, seeing the US Nation as one of freedom and equality. But nowadays, Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island still deal with social, educational, language, housing, and employment discrimination&#8221;&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&brvbar; Why?</p>

<p>6. That you are committed to equal treatment of all service members and believe all patriotic Americans should be allowed to serve our country without discrimination, persecution or violence.</p>

<p>Puerto Ricans have served in the US Armed Forces since 1917. In all the wars in which the US has been involved, the participation of Puerto Rico has been greater than that of 22 states of the Union. Over 225,000 Puerto Ricans have fought in all US wars since World War I. More than 2,000 have been killed in action; more than 3,000 wounded, and hundreds have remained disabled for life. Four Puerto Ricans have received the Congressional Medal of Honor for heroism. As it was the case in the past, during the present state of war in which our Nation finds itself fighting the savage and cowardly terrorists, Puerto Ricans are voluntarily offering to serve and the members of our National Guard and Reserve Components are responding to the call of duty (as up today 55 Puerto Ricans soldiers have died in the Irak war). The above could not be more eloquent evidence of the trust and confidence which the US has placed in Puerto Ricans. The US Nation has a debt with all of those Puerto Ricans who, throughout these 109 years, have served in the US Armed Forces. It has to be #110 Congressmen responsibility to work for obtaining for them the 100% of the benefits they deserve under the federal and state laws.</p>

<p>7. That for all those who live under our flag, you support strong economic development and fair and equitable treatment under federal programs.</p>

<p>For 109 years, as a US territory the Commonwealth of PR has had a poor economic growth if we compared it with the 50 states, and the difference between the Island and the States is wider with every sunset. In the past 30 years, the Island&#8217;s economy has decreased and continues decreasing. Nor the lower federal benefits nor the income tax exemptions that PR receives have been sufficient to obtain the expected growth rate. Under the Commonwealth, PR has not been able to close the difference between it and the poorest states of the US Nation. Our labor force participation is under the Arkansas, Mississippi and North Carolina ones; our unemployment rate is twice the US; our poverty indicators are near the 50%, and our older citizens receive pensions under the average of the 50 states. In summary, Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island have more difficulty to obtain a job; when we find one, we receive a lower salary, and when we retire, we receive fewer benefits compared with the Puerto Ricans who reside in the Mainland. As you may see, as a territory Puerto Ricans will never reach our objective to obtain greater levels of income and economic growth because of the limitations this condition imposes us.</p>

<p>&#8220;The future does not belong to fear; it belongs to the freedom&#8221;&Atilde;‚?. It&#8217;s time, Mr. Chirols, that the new #110 US Congressmen give Puerto Ricans who reside in the Island the opportunity to choose among realistic permanent and fully democratic status options.</p>

<p>Sincerely,</p>

<p>Norika Rodr&Atilde;ƒ&AElig;’&Atilde;‚&Acirc;&shy;guez Carmona<br />
US citizen who resides in Puerto Rico<br />
Santa Juana IV<br />
X2 10A St.<br />
Caguas, PR <span class="caps">USA </span> 00725-2081</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: lirelou</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-2/#comment-233828</link>
		<dc:creator>lirelou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jan 2007 00:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-233828</guid>
		<description>In response to Carlos&#039; rhetorical question: Because as a democracy, the U.S. has respected the status that the people of Puerto Rico, actively, passively, or by default, have supported. I.e., the allegedly &quot;free associated state&quot;. That the overwhelming majority of Puertorricans have never shown support for statehood is not the fault of the Congress. It is ours. And forget the slavery arguments. Slaves never voted in plebescites, or received welfare payments.

The &quot;Puerto Rico as colony&quot; argument is a construct that Congress does not presently accept. Colonies are governed by the Metropolis, and the colonial subjects are not citizens. Even when they move to the Metropolis, the cannot vote in elections. That the PNP adopted a Humpty-Dumpty definition that makes Puerto Rico a colony (originally argued by &quot;fupistas&quot; and &quot;pipiolos&quot; seeking support for their cause) does not resonate among any in congress save for the few Puertorrican leftists there who have infiltrated Congress&#039; ranks.  

You state an eloquent case, but you must know your jury. We are ten years from the centennial of the Jones Act. That gives you ten years to sell the Humpty Dumpty definition, or find a ore nuanced approach. As stated previously, I believe that they should set a date for Independence, began cutting federal funds to the island in preparation for making it fiscally independent, and include a &quot;notwithstanding&quot; clause in the Puerto Rico Independence Act. I.e, &quot;notwithstanding the provisions above, should the People of Puerto Rico express their overwhelming desire to remain within the United States via a democratically conducted plebescite, the Congress shall entertain a bill proposing statehood for the island.&quot;  (Note that the Congress&#039; power is not unilateral. THe President must approve the bill for it to become law. Thus, the political battle will be for more than the Congress&#039; support.)

And overwhelming had better be just that. Otherwise, you will be living in another bankrupt republic (as an expatriate American citizen). Americans are a practical people, and there are some very practical arguments for cutting Puerto Rico away altogether. Neither the &quot;shining star&quot; of the Caribbean, nor Hawaii (which we&#039;re now stuck with), would make a pimple on the behind of Taiwan, Singapore, or Hong Kong. All of these are more heavily populated than Puerto Rico (and Hawaii), all are subject to natural disasters such as typhoons, floods, and earthquakes, and all are financially independent, though only the first two enjoy territorial sovereignty. Americans put a lot of money into Puerto Rico, and our arguments for the benefits they get will find some powerful counterpoints as those examples show. The &quot;we bled for the U.S.&quot; should also be used with caution. First, someone might mention Kelly Hill (where units of the 65th Infantry refused orders to attack). Second, a lot of non-U.S. citizens fought for this country, to include more than a few Mexicans. Several Mexicans even received the Medal of Honor. Yet that is hardly an argument for making Mexico a state of the union. Moreover, some congressman might just ask: &quot;And how many of those wars did you (the speaker) serve in?&quot; Not all of us were Sargento Cartagenas, and &quot;many&quot; does not mean &quot;the majority&quot;. (If you want to compare war records, take a look at Hawaii&#039;s WWII 442nd Infantry as compared to Puerto Rico&#039;s 65th Infantry.)

Sorry, I&#039;m off on a tangent, but you understand my point. Frame your arguments carefully, with your jury in mind. What draws a response in Bayamon, Cidra, or Aguasbuenas might boomerang badly in Georgetown and Alexandria. Enough! Obviously my previous post was &quot;la penultima&quot;. I apologize for breaking squelch and will sign off. But ...

The quickest way to get Congress to act, is to get Puerto Rico to act. And Puerto Rico&#039;s inaction (which can easily be construed as action expressing a desire NOT to be a state) is not the Congress&#039; fault.  The &quot;no es culpa nuestra&quot; argument will rightfully earn the Congress&#039; scorn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Carlos&#8217; rhetorical question: Because as a democracy, the <span class="caps">U.S. </span>has respected the status that the people of Puerto Rico, actively, passively, or by default, have supported. I.e., the allegedly &#8220;free associated state&#8221;. That the overwhelming majority of Puertorricans have never shown support for statehood is not the fault of the Congress. It is ours. And forget the slavery arguments. Slaves never voted in plebescites, or received welfare payments.</p>

<p>The &#8220;Puerto Rico as colony&#8221; argument is a construct that Congress does not presently accept. Colonies are governed by the Metropolis, and the colonial subjects are not citizens. Even when they move to the Metropolis, the cannot vote in elections. That the <span class="caps">PNP </span>adopted a Humpty-Dumpty definition that makes Puerto Rico a colony (originally argued by &#8220;fupistas&#8221; and &#8220;pipiolos&#8221; seeking support for their cause) does not resonate among any in congress save for the few Puertorrican leftists there who have infiltrated Congress&#8217; ranks.  </p>

<p>You state an eloquent case, but you must know your jury. We are ten years from the centennial of the Jones Act. That gives you ten years to sell the Humpty Dumpty definition, or find a ore nuanced approach. As stated previously, I believe that they should set a date for Independence, began cutting federal funds to the island in preparation for making it fiscally independent, and include a &#8220;notwithstanding&#8221; clause in the Puerto Rico Independence Act. I.e, &#8220;notwithstanding the provisions above, should the People of Puerto Rico express their overwhelming desire to remain within the United States via a democratically conducted plebescite, the Congress shall entertain a bill proposing statehood for the island.&#8221;  (Note that the Congress&#8217; power is not unilateral. THe President must approve the bill for it to become law. Thus, the political battle will be for more than the Congress&#8217; support.)</p>

<p>And overwhelming had better be just that. Otherwise, you will be living in another bankrupt republic (as an expatriate American citizen). Americans are a practical people, and there are some very practical arguments for cutting Puerto Rico away altogether. Neither the &#8220;shining star&#8221; of the Caribbean, nor Hawaii (which we&#8217;re now stuck with), would make a pimple on the behind of Taiwan, Singapore, or Hong Kong. All of these are more heavily populated than Puerto Rico (and Hawaii), all are subject to natural disasters such as typhoons, floods, and earthquakes, and all are financially independent, though only the first two enjoy territorial sovereignty. Americans put a lot of money into Puerto Rico, and our arguments for the benefits they get will find some powerful counterpoints as those examples show. The &#8220;we bled for the <span class="caps">U.S.</span>&#8221; should also be used with caution. First, someone might mention Kelly Hill (where units of the 65th Infantry refused orders to attack). Second, a lot of non-U.S. citizens fought for this country, to include more than a few Mexicans. Several Mexicans even received the Medal of Honor. Yet that is hardly an argument for making Mexico a state of the union. Moreover, some congressman might just ask: &#8220;And how many of those wars did you (the speaker) serve in?&#8221; Not all of us were Sargento Cartagenas, and &#8220;many&#8221; does not mean &#8220;the majority&#8221;. (If you want to compare war records, take a look at Hawaii&#8217;s <span class="caps">WWII</span> 442nd Infantry as compared to Puerto Rico&#8217;s 65th Infantry.)</p>

<p>Sorry, I&#8217;m off on a tangent, but you understand my point. Frame your arguments carefully, with your jury in mind. What draws a response in Bayamon, Cidra, or Aguasbuenas might boomerang badly in Georgetown and Alexandria. Enough! Obviously my previous post was &#8220;la penultima&#8221;. I apologize for breaking squelch and will sign off. But &#8230;</p>

<p>The quickest way to get Congress to act, is to get Puerto Rico to act. And Puerto Rico&#8217;s inaction (which can easily be construed as action expressing a desire <span class="caps">NOT </span>to be a state) is not the Congress&#8217; fault.  The &#8220;no es culpa nuestra&#8221; argument will rightfully earn the Congress&#8217; scorn.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Carlos Padilla</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-233647</link>
		<dc:creator>Carlos Padilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jan 2007 19:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-233647</guid>
		<description>Why would the US, at the same time that it claims it is bringing democracy to the rest of the world,  want to hold a bankrupt colony, which is a drain on the US Treasury and only beneficial to a few families in Puerto Rico an the large corporations that do business with them?

If the US Congress, which has the constitutional duty of disposing of the territories it holds, finally comes to the conclusion that having Puerto Rico as a colony is tantamount to having a policy of equal but separate, decides that it will not have anymore of it  and therefore  gives Puerto Rico a choice between statehood or independence, you will have the 85% support that you are looking for.

You must understand that even if the slaves vote for slavery, it is still not a valid choice.

Similarly, a colony cannot vote to remain a colony. Therefore, the colonial status is not an option. It is the problem.

If a the same time you can show that the economy is bankrupt, that the same process of empowerment that occurred in 1948 and 1952 (when Puerto Ricans were allowed to choose their governor)  needs to take place today to let Puerto Ricans vote for their senators and the President, then there is neither a moral nor practical reason not to accept Puerto Rico as a state and keep it a colony.

Lincoln said, &quot;As  I would not be a slave, so I  would not be a master.&quot;

In the 21st century that translates to,  &quot;As the thirteen colonies  would not be colonies indefinitely , so they would not be an Empire keeping colonies indefinitely.&quot; 

 The US is a Republic. It has a process of making the territories equal an integral parts of the Republic, and that process is being denied to the US citizens of Puerto Rico based on the same arguments used in Plessy vs. Ferguson in the 19th century by the Supreme Court to justify a permanent policy of &quot;equal but separate&quot; for the blacks.

Congress needs to act.

Carlos Padilla</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why would the <span class="caps">US, </span>at the same time that it claims it is bringing democracy to the rest of the world,  want to hold a bankrupt colony, which is a drain on the US Treasury and only beneficial to a few families in Puerto Rico an the large corporations that do business with them?</p>

<p>If the US Congress, which has the constitutional duty of disposing of the territories it holds, finally comes to the conclusion that having Puerto Rico as a colony is tantamount to having a policy of equal but separate, decides that it will not have anymore of it  and therefore  gives Puerto Rico a choice between statehood or independence, you will have the 85% support that you are looking for.</p>

<p>You must understand that even if the slaves vote for slavery, it is still not a valid choice.</p>

<p>Similarly, a colony cannot vote to remain a colony. Therefore, the colonial status is not an option. It is the problem.</p>

<p>If a the same time you can show that the economy is bankrupt, that the same process of empowerment that occurred in 1948 and 1952 (when Puerto Ricans were allowed to choose their governor)  needs to take place today to let Puerto Ricans vote for their senators and the President, then there is neither a moral nor practical reason not to accept Puerto Rico as a state and keep it a colony.</p>

<p>Lincoln said, &#8220;As  I would not be a slave, so I  would not be a master.&#8221;</p>

<p>In the 21st century that translates to,  &#8220;As the thirteen colonies  would not be colonies indefinitely , so they would not be an Empire keeping colonies indefinitely.&#8221; </p>

<p> The US is a Republic. It has a process of making the territories equal an integral parts of the Republic, and that process is being denied to the US citizens of Puerto Rico based on the same arguments used in Plessy vs. Ferguson in the 19th century by the Supreme Court to justify a permanent policy of &#8220;equal but separate&#8221; for the blacks.</p>

<p>Congress needs to act.</p>

<p>Carlos Padilla</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Sonagi</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232946</link>
		<dc:creator>Sonagi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:00:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232946</guid>
		<description>A ballot with the presidential race only?  Very strange.  Absentee ballots normally contain all local, state, and federal contests printed on one large document.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A ballot with the presidential race only?  Very strange.  Absentee ballots normally contain all local, state, and federal contests printed on one large document.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: David Diaz</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232929</link>
		<dc:creator>David Diaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:35:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232929</guid>
		<description>This really sounds like the &quot;Dime y direte en Puerto Rico&quot;. It is virtually impossible to detrmine what favors Puerto Rico and what favor the 3.8 millions living in the Island. If you are to base comments on the rights of the land or the rights of the Americans living in the land.  It is true that we are not an incorporated territory, which is the same principal that the Americans Washington DC area are going through.  Since Puerto Rico became a possession of USA, we would have to look into how righteous  was the law governing the territory created, if it has implications, would they have to be ad mended and or negotiated by both the USA and the governing part of the territory. If the governing part of the island has the authority to do so or not? If not the Congress would have to and official of all three ideologies would have to be included in the negotiations. I think thats very well understood.  The big issue would be, is the congress willing to would they come up with the time to look into it?  And these same arguments are the strategic of those who believe in the so called commonwealth to use against statehood&#039;s believers.  The rights of citizenship would be fully applied once the territory it self is defined.  The cause of the problem is on the law governing the land, not the people.

   I am not a lawyer , but just look into what I just said and end of the  problem.  We been looking in the wrong place to solve the problem.  Werther congress desires to really look into this or not  it is their call.  Once they take the step to solve this matter, then and only then we can start talking about Puerto Rico becoming a state.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This really sounds like the &#8220;Dime y direte en Puerto Rico&#8221;. It is virtually impossible to detrmine what favors Puerto Rico and what favor the 3.8 millions living in the Island. If you are to base comments on the rights of the land or the rights of the Americans living in the land.  It is true that we are not an incorporated territory, which is the same principal that the Americans Washington DC area are going through.  Since Puerto Rico became a possession of <span class="caps">USA, </span>we would have to look into how righteous  was the law governing the territory created, if it has implications, would they have to be ad mended and or negotiated by both the <span class="caps">USA </span>and the governing part of the territory. If the governing part of the island has the authority to do so or not? If not the Congress would have to and official of all three ideologies would have to be included in the negotiations. I think thats very well understood.  The big issue would be, is the congress willing to would they come up with the time to look into it?  And these same arguments are the strategic of those who believe in the so called commonwealth to use against statehood&#8217;s believers.  The rights of citizenship would be fully applied once the territory it self is defined.  The cause of the problem is on the law governing the land, not the people.</p>

<p>   I am not a lawyer , but just look into what I just said and end of the  problem.  We been looking in the wrong place to solve the problem.  Werther congress desires to really look into this or not  it is their call.  Once they take the step to solve this matter, then and only then we can start talking about Puerto Rico becoming a state.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Chariquintero</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232921</link>
		<dc:creator>Chariquintero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:22:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232921</guid>
		<description>To Sonagi:

This is not my case. This case was with a friend of mine that is the son of a very prestigious Doctor in Mayaguez PR. He was studying Medicine in Dominican Republic and in the 2004 election he had the gift or pleasure of excercise his civil right of voting for the President of the United States but he only got the ballot to vote for the president.  And again the irony here is that he never got the voting ballot to vote in the Puerto Rican election but he had the ballot to vote for the president. 
Ro</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Sonagi:</p>

<p>This is not my case. This case was with a friend of mine that is the son of a very prestigious Doctor in Mayaguez <span class="caps">PR.</span> He was studying Medicine in Dominican Republic and in the 2004 election he had the gift or pleasure of excercise his civil right of voting for the President of the United States but he only got the ballot to vote for the president.  And again the irony here is that he never got the voting ballot to vote in the Puerto Rican election but he had the ballot to vote for the president. <br />
Ro</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Wilma Cadilla</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232610</link>
		<dc:creator>Wilma Cadilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:22:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232610</guid>
		<description>Puerto Rican enter the US military services voluntarily and have been praised for their patriotrism and professionalism.....   they serve with pride and courage to protect democracy throughout the World, even though they don&#039;t enjoy full democratic rights in their own country.  Eng. Rolon is right....   more than 90% of Puerto Ricans treasure their American citizenship and want to keep it.....  the  problem here is that colonialists spread misinformation about the consequences of statehood and block every effort to allow a decision to be made.  We need to educate our people and the people in the U.S.

Also, please be advised that more Puerto Ricans live in the continental U.S.   right now, than in Puerto Rico, and they have NOT affected the way Americans communicate amongst themselves, not changed their customs.....   quite the contrary, they adapt to the American way of life, they learn and speak the English language, obey the laws and make a better living than they can in Puerto Rico.  They still speak Spanish at home, eat rice and beans and celebrate Three King&#039;s Day......  

The same goes for other ethnic groups who establish themselves in the Continental U.S.......  chinese, vietnamese, hondurans, etc.... they all learn English and adopt the American way of life......  some Americans do learn Spanish and learn about their cultures and customs and share them....  there is nothing wrong with that, and I think it helps enrich the American culture......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Puerto Rican enter the US military services voluntarily and have been praised for their patriotrism and professionalism&#8230;..   they serve with pride and courage to protect democracy throughout the World, even though they don&#8217;t enjoy full democratic rights in their own country.  Eng. Rolon is right&#8230;.   more than 90% of Puerto Ricans treasure their American citizenship and want to keep it&#8230;..  the  problem here is that colonialists spread misinformation about the consequences of statehood and block every effort to allow a decision to be made.  We need to educate our people and the people in the <span class="caps">U.S.</span></p>

<p>Also, please be advised that more Puerto Ricans live in the continental <span class="caps">U.S.   </span>right now, than in Puerto Rico, and they have <span class="caps">NOT </span>affected the way Americans communicate amongst themselves, not changed their customs&#8230;..   quite the contrary, they adapt to the American way of life, they learn and speak the English language, obey the laws and make a better living than they can in Puerto Rico.  They still speak Spanish at home, eat rice and beans and celebrate Three King&#8217;s Day&#8230;&#8230;  </p>

<p>The same goes for other ethnic groups who establish themselves in the Continental <span class="caps">U.S&#8230;&#8230;.  </span>chinese, vietnamese, hondurans, etc&#8230;. they all learn English and adopt the American way of life&#8230;&#8230;  some Americans do learn Spanish and learn about their cultures and customs and share them&#8230;.  there is nothing wrong with that, and I think it helps enrich the American culture&#8230;&#8230;</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Eng. Manuel Rolon Marrero</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232486</link>
		<dc:creator>Eng. Manuel Rolon Marrero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:47:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232486</guid>
		<description>The question is , if puertorricans wants  to be without US relationship. More than 90% would answer No. Otherwise if the island is under critical circuntances, is due to colonial status , the only colony in the world. We don&#039;t have choises congress control economics, political issues. We have the best conditions for port trading in the carrribean, imagine Europe , China, trading from Puerto Rico to LathinAmerica, Mr. Chirol don&#039;t pushed.....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The question is , if puertorricans wants  to be without US relationship. More than 90% would answer No. Otherwise if the island is under critical circuntances, is due to colonial status , the only colony in the world. We don&#8217;t have choises congress control economics, political issues. We have the best conditions for port trading in the carrribean, imagine Europe , China, trading from Puerto Rico to LathinAmerica, Mr. Chirol don&#8217;t pushed&#8230;..</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Chirol</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232433</link>
		<dc:creator>Chirol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:44:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232433</guid>
		<description>dogbert: No, Puerto Ricans, as American citizens are included in the selective service system. There is no draft in America or any US territory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dogbert: No, Puerto Ricans, as American citizens are included in the selective service system. There is no draft in America or any US territory.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: dogbert</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232366</link>
		<dc:creator>dogbert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232366</guid>
		<description>Have I misunderstood something?  Is there a military draft in effect in Puerto Rico?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have I misunderstood something?  Is there a military draft in effect in Puerto Rico?</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mutantfrog Travelogue &#187; Blog Archive &#187; What might have been?</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232329</link>
		<dc:creator>Mutantfrog Travelogue &#187; Blog Archive &#187; What might have been?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:18:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232329</guid>
		<description>[...] Speaking of the Philippines and historical predictions, there is a great discussion going on over at the blog Coming Anarchy over the past, present and future status of Puerto Rico. Puerto Rico, Guam and the Philippines were all transferred from Spanish to United States control together, with the 1898 December 10 signing of the Treaty of Paris that concluded the Spanish-American War (as well as a payment of $20 million from the US to Spain.) Both Puerto Rico and Guam remain unincorporated territories of the United States of America, but the US and the Philippines parted company long ago. Reading this discussion gives you a pretty good idea of why the Philippines was spun off into an independent country instead of being either incorporated into the union or kept in colonial status. Today Americans are concerned about being demographically overwhelmed by Hispanics, but true annexation of the Philippines would have been a massive and sudden demographic shock that would have profoundly changed the subsequent development of both. For the people who think the Puerto Rico situation is complicated, try and imagine what might have happened if the Philippines, with a population twenty times that of Puerto Rico, and speaking a polyglot of languages, had all become US citizens overnight. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Speaking of the Philippines and historical predictions, there is a great discussion going on over at the blog Coming Anarchy over the past, present and future status of Puerto Rico. Puerto Rico, Guam and the Philippines were all transferred from Spanish to United States control together, with the 1898 December 10 signing of the Treaty of Paris that concluded the Spanish-American War (as well as a payment of $20 million from the US to Spain.) Both Puerto Rico and Guam remain unincorporated territories of the United States of America, but the US and the Philippines parted company long ago. Reading this discussion gives you a pretty good idea of why the Philippines was spun off into an independent country instead of being either incorporated into the union or kept in colonial status. Today Americans are concerned about being demographically overwhelmed by Hispanics, but true annexation of the Philippines would have been a massive and sudden demographic shock that would have profoundly changed the subsequent development of both. For the people who think the Puerto Rico situation is complicated, try and imagine what might have happened if the Philippines, with a population twenty times that of Puerto Rico, and speaking a polyglot of languages, had all become US citizens overnight. [...]</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: lirelou</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232313</link>
		<dc:creator>lirelou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:21:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232313</guid>
		<description>Ultima palabra!: 1952, ano en que el PIP gano 26% del voto, siendo su presidente D. Gilberto Concepcion de Gracia, ano en que tambien hubieron muchos veteranos en sus rangos.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ultima palabra!: 1952, ano en que el <span class="caps">PIP </span>gano 26% del voto, siendo su presidente D. Gilberto Concepcion de Gracia, ano en que tambien hubieron muchos veteranos en sus rangos.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Wilma Cadilla</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232170</link>
		<dc:creator>Wilma Cadilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232170</guid>
		<description>lirelou:

We DO have a Constitution written based on the US Constitution and approved by Congress.  Very little changes would be needed to adapt it  for a State.  It went into effect in 1952.

I do agree with you that action from Congress is needed to make the changes we want and I also agree they should set a deadline and stick to it.  I am sure we could get 85% of voters to vote for statehood, IF we get Congress to include only two options: STATEHOOD OR INDEPENDENCE!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lirelou:</p>

<p>We DO have a Constitution written based on the US Constitution and approved by Congress.  Very little changes would be needed to adapt it  for a State.  It went into effect in 1952.</p>

<p>I do agree with you that action from Congress is needed to make the changes we want and I also agree they should set a deadline and stick to it.  I am sure we could get 85% of voters to vote for statehood, IF we get Congress to include only two options: <span class="caps">STATEHOOD</span> OR <span class="caps">INDEPENDENCE</span>!!</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: lirelou</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232169</link>
		<dc:creator>lirelou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:30:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232169</guid>
		<description>And for the record, this American citizen residing in Korea does not get to vote in federal elections either. My present state of residence does not allow voting based upon a post office box address.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And for the record, this American citizen residing in Korea does not get to vote in federal elections either. My present state of residence does not allow voting based upon a post office box address.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: lirelou</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232167</link>
		<dc:creator>lirelou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:23:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232167</guid>
		<description>Wilma, yes over a long history, the process has differed from that established by the Northwest Ordinance, but as I see it, the very least Puerto Rico would have to do would be to petition the U.S. Congress to be allowed to draw up a state constitution, which would be presented to the Congress to act as the basis for the bill that would have to go through both houses of Congress and be signed by the President. Since the chances of such a petition getting through any present or near future Puertorrican legislative body are zero, asking the Congress to skip this exercise in sounding out local opinion and political will, by unilaterally offering a bill that essentially writes out commonwealth status and guarantees statehood, is an extraordinary measure. I can see some historical scenarios under which the U.S. might have been willing to do so, but not at present. Puerto Rico is not a state because a significant percentage of the voting population do not want it to be so. However misguided their judgment, that has been their decision through myriad elections, whether the PNP won or not.  You are all well aware of Congress&#039; power to legislate for unincorporated territories. Essentially Congress can grant Puerto Rico any political status it (the congress) wishes. But unilaterally granting it statehood is highly unlikely under current conditions. What will have to be shown is that statehood is the desired by the majority of Puertorricans, and 52% is too low a majority. I agree that the time for extraordinary measures is here, but the will of the majority must be respected. The way to do that is to make statehood a life or death issue by clearly placing independence on the plate and marking a date for it. But that approach has risks. You may get what the majority (or even significant minority) of the ill-informed have asked for. My suspicion is that if the Congress set a date for independence, and began cutting back matching funds to the commonwealth government, the sentiment for statehood would grow exponentially.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wilma, yes over a long history, the process has differed from that established by the Northwest Ordinance, but as I see it, the very least Puerto Rico would have to do would be to petition the <span class="caps">U.S.</span> Congress to be allowed to draw up a state constitution, which would be presented to the Congress to act as the basis for the bill that would have to go through both houses of Congress and be signed by the President. Since the chances of such a petition getting through any present or near future Puertorrican legislative body are zero, asking the Congress to skip this exercise in sounding out local opinion and political will, by unilaterally offering a bill that essentially writes out commonwealth status and guarantees statehood, is an extraordinary measure. I can see some historical scenarios under which the <span class="caps">U.S. </span>might have been willing to do so, but not at present. Puerto Rico is not a state because a significant percentage of the voting population do not want it to be so. However misguided their judgment, that has been their decision through myriad elections, whether the <span class="caps">PNP </span>won or not.  You are all well aware of Congress&#8217; power to legislate for unincorporated territories. Essentially Congress can grant Puerto Rico any political status it (the congress) wishes. But unilaterally granting it statehood is highly unlikely under current conditions. What will have to be shown is that statehood is the desired by the majority of Puertorricans, and 52% is too low a majority. I agree that the time for extraordinary measures is here, but the will of the majority must be respected. The way to do that is to make statehood a life or death issue by clearly placing independence on the plate and marking a date for it. But that approach has risks. You may get what the majority (or even significant minority) of the ill-informed have asked for. My suspicion is that if the Congress set a date for independence, and began cutting back matching funds to the commonwealth government, the sentiment for statehood would grow exponentially.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Sonagi</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232146</link>
		<dc:creator>Sonagi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:15:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232146</guid>
		<description>Chariquintero wrote:

&lt;i&gt;But the irony here is that if I were out overseas during the election period I will receive the balling to vote from the embassy of the states. &lt;/i&gt;

Have you actually done this?  While living overseas, I received an absentee ballot &lt;b&gt;application&lt;/b&gt; through the embassy, but from then on, as I recall, the process of voting was completed through the registrar of the township where I had long been registered to vote.  I mailed the completed application to her, received the blank ballot from her, and mailed the completed ballot back to her.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chariquintero wrote:</p>

<p><i>But the irony here is that if I were out overseas during the election period I will receive the balling to vote from the embassy of the states. </i></p>

<p>Have you actually done this?  While living overseas, I received an absentee ballot <b>application</b> through the embassy, but from then on, as I recall, the process of voting was completed through the registrar of the township where I had long been registered to vote.  I mailed the completed application to her, received the blank ballot from her, and mailed the completed ballot back to her.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Miriam Ramirez</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232124</link>
		<dc:creator>Miriam Ramirez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:34:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232124</guid>
		<description>We were all made US citizens on March 1917.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We were all made US citizens on March 1917.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mutantfrog</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232123</link>
		<dc:creator>Mutantfrog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232123</guid>
		<description>Does anyone know at which date residents of Puerto Rico and the minor former Spanish possessions such as Guam were given US citizenship? I&#039;ve been reading quite a bit about the Philippines recently, and this discussion makes a fascinating contrast-particularly in that citizenship was never granted to, or even seriously on the table as an option for Filipinos.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does anyone know at which date residents of Puerto Rico and the minor former Spanish possessions such as Guam were given US citizenship? I&#8217;ve been reading quite a bit about the Philippines recently, and this discussion makes a fascinating contrast-particularly in that citizenship was never granted to, or even seriously on the table as an option for Filipinos.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chariquintero</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232114</link>
		<dc:creator>Chariquintero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:23:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232114</guid>
		<description>To Lirelou
Thank you for the correction. I use to think that our system was based ont eh Louisianna State system. And I remember to hear a Prof in college saying that. And I am not a lawyer I am a Biologist (my mistake repeating what I hear) but since the source was a Profesor that was a lawyer. I should check out next time. 
Thanks 
 
To Chirol 
You are right about the voting issue with PR since we aren&#039;t a state and we don&#039;t have representation and the complex election system of the States we will never be able to vote from PR. But the irony here is that if I were out overseas during the election period I will receive the balling to vote from the embassy of the states. Curiose even if you are Puerto Rican thar live in Puerto Rico. Thank you for attention
Ro</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Lirelou<br />
Thank you for the correction. I use to think that our system was based ont eh Louisianna State system. And I remember to hear a Prof in college saying that. And I am not a lawyer I am a Biologist (my mistake repeating what I hear) but since the source was a Profesor that was a lawyer. I should check out next time. <br />
Thanks <br />
 <br />
To Chirol <br />
You are right about the voting issue with PR since we aren&#8217;t a state and we don&#8217;t have representation and the complex election system of the States we will never be able to vote from <span class="caps">PR.</span> But the irony here is that if I were out overseas during the election period I will receive the balling to vote from the embassy of the states. Curiose even if you are Puerto Rican thar live in Puerto Rico. Thank you for attention<br />
Ro</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: lirelou</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232099</link>
		<dc:creator>lirelou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:05:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232099</guid>
		<description>Chariquintero, obviously we studied at different law schools. My professor was Dr. Alejo de Cervera, and my thesis for Jaime Fuster&#039;s class on philosophy of law was &quot;la institucion del alimento pendente lite en el derecho civil cotidiano&quot;. The basis of Puertorrican law is Spanish civil law. Check out the references in your Codigo Civil. My old copy references the original articles in the Spanish Civil Code. Once upon a time, we even had investigating (prosecuting) judges, until the federal courts struck them down. Yes, the Constitution of the U.S. is the supreme law of the land, and while we have a maritime code within our business code, it is inoperable due to federal matter jurisdiction. Puertorrican law is not based upon the Louisiana civil code, but very much like Louisiana, it absorbed many English common law principles, though not necessarily the same ones. And yes, both codes owe their roots to the Napoleonic Code. 

What I hear the &quot;insularismo&quot; side saying here is: Commonwealth is broke. That&#039;s the fault of the United States, because we&#039;re a colony. Fix it.  I dissent  from your reasoning, but I agree with you all on your conclusions. Without federal intervention, the status issue will never be resolved. But this intervention cannot be risk free. If the Congress is going to intervene, essentially cutting the rug from under the commonwealthers, it cannot guarantee statehood, and indeed, it must leave full independence as an obvious alternative. Were I drafting that law, I would set the bar at 85%. If Puerto Rico cannot convince that many of its own citizens to choose to be Americans first, then Congress should set a definite date for independence and you ladies and gentlemen can began reviewing your futures as expatriate Americans in &quot;la isla del encanto&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chariquintero, obviously we studied at different law schools. My professor was Dr. Alejo de Cervera, and my thesis for Jaime Fuster&#8217;s class on philosophy of law was &#8220;la institucion del alimento pendente lite en el derecho civil cotidiano&#8221;. The basis of Puertorrican law is Spanish civil law. Check out the references in your Codigo Civil. My old copy references the original articles in the Spanish Civil Code. Once upon a time, we even had investigating (prosecuting) judges, until the federal courts struck them down. Yes, the Constitution of the <span class="caps">U.S. </span>is the supreme law of the land, and while we have a maritime code within our business code, it is inoperable due to federal matter jurisdiction. Puertorrican law is not based upon the Louisiana civil code, but very much like Louisiana, it absorbed many English common law principles, though not necessarily the same ones. And yes, both codes owe their roots to the Napoleonic Code. </p>

<p>What I hear the &#8220;insularismo&#8221; side saying here is: Commonwealth is broke. That&#8217;s the fault of the United States, because we&#8217;re a colony. Fix it.  I dissent  from your reasoning, but I agree with you all on your conclusions. Without federal intervention, the status issue will never be resolved. But this intervention cannot be risk free. If the Congress is going to intervene, essentially cutting the rug from under the commonwealthers, it cannot guarantee statehood, and indeed, it must leave full independence as an obvious alternative. Were I drafting that law, I would set the bar at 85%. If Puerto Rico cannot convince that many of its own citizens to choose to be Americans first, then Congress should set a definite date for independence and you ladies and gentlemen can began reviewing your futures as expatriate Americans in &#8220;la isla del encanto&#8221;.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Wilma Cadilla</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-232013</link>
		<dc:creator>Wilma Cadilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:21:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-232013</guid>
		<description>In response to:  
lirelou- American citizens residing in Puerto Rico DO NOT enjoy full civil rights.  We do not have the right to vote for our President and Vic-President, and we DO NOT have the right to elect voting members in Congress.  Therefore, we cannot decide on which laws get enacted and which ones apply to us or not.  

Also, I would like to know what you think the statehood process is that would be &quot;trashed&quot; by admitting us as the 51st State.  It seems each State went through different processes, depending on their specific issues.  There is no such thing as a defined &quot;statehood process&quot;, unless I have missed something you didn&#039;t.

In response to: Chirol

It seems to me you have the wrong idea about how our Island is managed and how the PR-US relationship works.  We have a seudo-self-government that is not self-governing, since it is subject to federal laws and regulations.  This is not so different in the 50 States.  They have their own state government, laws and regulations, their own governors and legislatures.  They are also subject to federal laws and regulations.  But they also have Senators and Representatives in Congress to make sure federal legislation approved in Congress is to their advantage.   We cannot do that, since we only have a Resident Commissioner with no voting power in the House of Representatives.

Becoming the 51st State would give us the same level of autonomy and self-government as the 50 States now enjoy.  As things stand now, we have less rights than they do.  Not the other way around.

In general, I would like to clarify that it is NOT TRUE that Puerto Ricans DO NOT pay federal income tax.  That is not correct, since there are may federal employees in Puerto Rico who actually pay federal income tax. And we also pay other taxes imposed by the federal government on certain products we buy in Puerto Rico, such as foreign cars and other products.  This tax is included in the purchase price and so we are not fully aware of it.  But it is there, trust me.

Also, even though many of our laws are based on Spanish laws, like our Civil Code, many other laws in Puerto Rico are based on common law and federal laws.  There are other States, such as California, Louisiana and Florida who have Spanish laws still in effect. In fact, Louisiana has a civil code similar to ours.

Finally, as Mr. Carlos Padilla has noted in other forums, poverty levels and dependence on federal aid would decrease considerably in Puerto Rico if we could participate on equal footing with the 50 states, in the national economy.  Elimination of tax benefits to multi-national companies and other local big businesses would force them to open the market to competition and employment figures would also improve.  Paying federal taxes would also produce more participation in certain programs, allow us to receive more funds for better roads and transportation needs, for example.  Social security beneficiaries would enjoy higher benefits than they do now, and so on.   But we would be paying our fair share into the funds we would be later receiving.

More competition and private employment are necessary to end over 50 yrs of 90% government employment levels. In other words, 90% of employed people here work for the government because there are not enough private jobs available. This creates a vicious cycle of dependence on low-paying jobs, a bigger than necessary government budget and payroll expenses, and the continuance of political party control of the limited resources of the government and the vote of those they employ.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to:  <br />
lirelou- American citizens residing in Puerto Rico DO <span class="caps">NOT </span>enjoy full civil rights.  We do not have the right to vote for our President and Vic-President, and we DO <span class="caps">NOT </span>have the right to elect voting members in Congress.  Therefore, we cannot decide on which laws get enacted and which ones apply to us or not.  </p>

<p>Also, I would like to know what you think the statehood process is that would be &#8220;trashed&#8221; by admitting us as the 51st State.  It seems each State went through different processes, depending on their specific issues.  There is no such thing as a defined &#8220;statehood process&#8221;, unless I have missed something you didn&#8217;t.</p>

<p>In response to: Chirol</p>

<p>It seems to me you have the wrong idea about how our Island is managed and how the PR-US relationship works.  We have a seudo-self-government that is not self-governing, since it is subject to federal laws and regulations.  This is not so different in the 50 States.  They have their own state government, laws and regulations, their own governors and legislatures.  They are also subject to federal laws and regulations.  But they also have Senators and Representatives in Congress to make sure federal legislation approved in Congress is to their advantage.   We cannot do that, since we only have a Resident Commissioner with no voting power in the House of Representatives.</p>

<p>Becoming the 51st State would give us the same level of autonomy and self-government as the 50 States now enjoy.  As things stand now, we have less rights than they do.  Not the other way around.</p>

<p>In general, I would like to clarify that it is <span class="caps">NOT TRUE </span>that Puerto Ricans DO <span class="caps">NOT </span>pay federal income tax.  That is not correct, since there are may federal employees in Puerto Rico who actually pay federal income tax. And we also pay other taxes imposed by the federal government on certain products we buy in Puerto Rico, such as foreign cars and other products.  This tax is included in the purchase price and so we are not fully aware of it.  But it is there, trust me.</p>

<p>Also, even though many of our laws are based on Spanish laws, like our Civil Code, many other laws in Puerto Rico are based on common law and federal laws.  There are other States, such as California, Louisiana and Florida who have Spanish laws still in effect. In fact, Louisiana has a civil code similar to ours.</p>

<p>Finally, as Mr. Carlos Padilla has noted in other forums, poverty levels and dependence on federal aid would decrease considerably in Puerto Rico if we could participate on equal footing with the 50 states, in the national economy.  Elimination of tax benefits to multi-national companies and other local big businesses would force them to open the market to competition and employment figures would also improve.  Paying federal taxes would also produce more participation in certain programs, allow us to receive more funds for better roads and transportation needs, for example.  Social security beneficiaries would enjoy higher benefits than they do now, and so on.   But we would be paying our fair share into the funds we would be later receiving.</p>

<p>More competition and private employment are necessary to end over 50 yrs of 90% government employment levels. In other words, 90% of employed people here work for the government because there are not enough private jobs available. This creates a vicious cycle of dependence on low-paying jobs, a bigger than necessary government budget and payroll expenses, and the continuance of political party control of the limited resources of the government and the vote of those they employ.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Chirol</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-231978</link>
		<dc:creator>Chirol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-231978</guid>
		<description>Hmm, my gravatar still isn&#039;t coming up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, my gravatar still isn&#8217;t coming up.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Chirol</title>
		<link>http://cominganarchy.com/2007/01/13/chirols-take-on-a-51st-state/comment-page-1/#comment-231973</link>
		<dc:creator>Chirol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:34:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cominganarchy.com/?p=2432#comment-231973</guid>
		<description>Don&#039;t misunderstand. Puerto Ricans are responsible for their present situation insofar as having voted for it 3 times in a row. That&#039;s what I meant. I&#039;m not arguing about whether it&#039;s fair or not. 

Let&#039;s not overreact and start comparing it to slavery. Next you&#039;ll be talking about Hitler.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t misunderstand. Puerto Ricans are responsible for their present situation insofar as having voted for it 3 times in a row. That&#8217;s what I meant. I&#8217;m not arguing about whether it&#8217;s fair or not. </p>

<p>Let&#8217;s not overreact and start comparing it to slavery. Next you&#8217;ll be talking about Hitler.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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