Comments on: Anarchy in New Orleans

By: J.Kende

J.Kende — Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:15:53 +0000

“wow, troops executing american citizens in the streets, the US has really fallen apart over this.”

What are you talking about?

By: Mutantfrog

Mutantfrog — Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:50:30 +0000

Federal law prohibits the military from being deployed for law enforcement purposes within the borders of the US, although it’s sometimes overridden in cases of extreme emergency such as this one. Maybe they could have decided it was such an emergency earlier.

Put this link into windows media player for a very creepy live web-cam view of downtown New Orleans.
http://194.97.144.25/NewOrleans

By: futuremongolian

futuremongolian — Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:42:26 +0000

wow, troops executing american citizens in the streets, the US has really fallen apart over this.

By: Eddie

Eddie — Fri, 02 Sep 2005 09:41:15 +0000

Thank you mutantfrog.
I see now they have deployed the nuclear carrier USS Harry Truman to the region, essentially to serve in a similar support and command and control role that the Abraham Lincoln filled during the tsunami relief effort.
My next question would be (granting the military is about the only fed. organization left that can adequately respond, by and large, to whatever, whenever); why so late? Why wasn’t it deployed a day or two before the hurricane hit? It isn’t that hard to put an aircraft carrier (and the many other ships now on their way to the Gulf) out to sea, and if nothing had happened, they could have written it off as an “emergency sortie” drill. I know this is done all the time, just last week, my ship (an aircraft carrier), the Kitty Hawk, pulled out of port within 36 hours to get underway to avoid a typhoon (that ended up not even hitting our homeport).

By: Mutantfrog

Mutantfrog — Fri, 02 Sep 2005 04:24:58 +0000

Eddie. you asked in your first comment what’s going on with FEMA - basically FEMA was decimated during the reorganization of the government that involved the creation of the Department of Homeland Security, and their former duties were left in a state of uncertain accountability, so there was no federal agency with adequate power to oversee a disaster of this scope, and local authorities lacked some of the familiar communications channels they had been accustomed to.

By: J.Kende

J.Kende — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 23:26:44 +0000

Heh.. just by a bit.

Totally understandable though. It’s hard to believe how bad it is down there.

By: Eddie

Eddie — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 22:46:38 +0000

Count me as wrong, folks toting AK-47’s shooting up police stations, snipers firing at medics and helicopters, killings, gang warfare… yea, I was off the mark…

By: J.Kende

J.Kende — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 18:22:20 +0000

“When will Bush announce the War on Weather?

Oh, wait, he’s already tried “taking out”Ã�? Mother Nature.”

Funny, I was thinking that the reason the Left can’t stand the War on Terror is because they think it diverts scarce resources away from a War on Weather…

By: Chief Wiggum

Chief Wiggum — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 15:42:00 +0000

I’ve heard that the dikes protecting New Orleans from the waters of Lake Pontchatrain were designed to withstand a storm up to a category 3. Katrina, as we know, was a category 4. So, when the dikes were built, a decision was made to gamble that no category 4 storm would hit the city.

It’s going to get much uglier before it gets better. There are tens of thousands of people with no shelter, food and water, jobs to go to, etc., living in what is turning into an enormous sewer. The Pentagon war games potential conflict scenarios. I’ve got to think there is a plan in place to deal with a catastrophe on this scale. This is a tremendously dangerous situation. I’ve heard some reports of gunbattles in New Orleans between groups of thugs and thugs and police.

The U.N. relief organizations won’t touch this because there are no five star hotels in the area where their staffs can live. Will Kofi Annan offer peacekeepers?

By: Gollios

Gollios — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 13:41:57 +0000

Regarding the reports of police inside stores–I think that they were primarily trying to take ammunition to keep it out of the hands of looters. Also, they have wide powers to commandeer private property in the case of an emergency.

As for the upkeep of levees & pumps, etc and the loss of some federal funding for the war on terror–Don’t you think that the city of New Orleans and the State of Lousisanna bear blame for this? Both institutions have a reputation as being notoriously corrupt.

I’ve found it interesting to contrast the response in the smaller communities and even some of the larger cities in Mississippi. It seems as if social order was restored much more quickly. Population density may be playing a major role in the ongoing anarchy.

By: Kushibo

Kushibo — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 09:32:58 +0000

When will Bush announce the War on Weather?

Oh, wait, he’s already tried “taking out” Mother Nature.

By: J.Kende

J.Kende — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 07:53:47 +0000

I’ve heard of the murders and rapes. It seems like there are two broad forms of looting and disarray going on. Good people in an utter catastrophe cut off from all immediate aid and a clear sense of how to survive, going out and getting whatever they can to get by…. Versus vile people taking the chance provided by the total breakdown of the social structure to victimize anyone they can.

Like the difference between NYC in 1977 as compared to 2001 and 2003, the difference between the reaction in NYC and the reaction in New Orleans to the shock, fear, and not knowing whether this massive threat to the survival of everyone you know is just a short thing or a catastrophe without end, is just astounding.

By the way, Mutantfrog, I don’t doubt you mean well, but terrorism is a real threat not a potential one. Yes, natural disasters are an all too real threat as well, which deserve the utmost of attention to the prevention of damages from them… but that doesn’t make the threat of terrorism any less real or dangerous.

By: Mutantfrog

Mutantfrog — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 07:45:29 +0000

Speaking of anarchy, you can get some great accounts on local blogs like this one.
http://www.livejournal.com/users/interdictor/

The situation for the NOPD is critical. This is firsthand information I have from an NOPD officer we’re giving shelter to. Their command and control infrastructure is shot. They have limited to no communication whatsoever. He didn’t even know the city was under martial law until we told him! His precinct (5th Precinct) is under water! UNDER WATER – every vehicle under water. They had to commander moving trucks like Ryder and UHaul to get around. The coroner’s office is shut down so bodies are being covered in leaves at best or left where they lie at worst.
They don’t even know their own rules of engagement. He says the force is impotent right now. They have no idea what’s going on, no coordination, virtually no comms, etc. the National Guard is gonna air drop a radio system for them with 200 radios? They are getting very little direction.

The 3rd District bugged out to Baton Rouge because they flooded out.

His quote: “It’s a zoo.”

More first hand information direct from him shortly. He’s trying to recover.
I am not trying to be an alarmist, but until we get a military presence of signicance in the city, the roving gangs of thugs own the streets.

By: Mutantfrog

Mutantfrog — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 06:48:57 +0000

What’s most disturbing is the fact that the government has been seriously underfunding the system of levees meant to protect New Orleans against a flood such as this one.

http://www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/8/30/212451/290

“It appears that the money has been moved in the president’s budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that’s the price we pay,” Maestri said. “Nobody locally is happy that the levees can’t be finished, and we are doing everything we can to make the case that this is a security issue for us.”

Terrorism may be a potential threat, but storms like this are invevitable. The people allocating resources need some rationality in their perspective.

By: Eddie

Eddie — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 04:13:34 +0000

In agreement with Chief Wiggum, I have not yet heard anything about rapes or murders (and I hope its not happening), so the looting doesn’t bother me at all, especially with the absolute failure of an adequate response from the state and federal government. What the heck is going on with FEMA and the state of Louisiana?

By: Chief Wiggum

Chief Wiggum — Thu, 01 Sep 2005 02:55:19 +0000

It may be asking too much to expect people to abstain from stealing food, water, batteries, etc., when they are thrust into a survival situation. But that is an entirely different matter from the rape, murder and thievery that too often accompany a breakdown of the social order. People who are ordinarily honest and peaceful sometimes behave badly when there is little or no fear of retribution by the authorities and “other people are doing it.” Unfortunately, these situations too often bring out the worst in people instead of the best.